Entry tags:
Avengers: Age of Ultron
Met ![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png)
kangeiko and naraht yesterday, which was lovely and included a brunch and a lengthy walk along the Thames respectively. I also watched Avengers: Age of Ultron. Non-spoilery version: I liked, though didn't love it the way i did the first movie. (Perhaps inevitable because getting-together-tales are a soft spot of mine.) Was tickled (by which I mean very amused) by some stuff that literally Josses lots of fanon, due to the fact that I wasn't keen or neutral towards said fanon. Rolled my eyes at one bit of dialogue, enjoyed lots of others (not surprisingly.) Because I watched it in close proximity to the Oppenheimer play , there were inevitable thematic overlaps for me. Was sad about SOMETHING which wasn't the something I expected. Do have a favourite among the new characters.
Because I was/am in a grumpy non-shipper type of mood, the fact Joss managed to torpedo not one but several ships in a non-lethal way amused the hell out of me, especially since the mere existence of Clint/Coulson always mystified me. Due to being brainwashed for much of the first movie, Clint had been the Avenger in need of fleshing out anyway, and giving him a secret (except for Natasha and Nick Fury, both of whom knew) family contributed to doing it, not to mention that the absolute contrast to the longe wolf/lethal agent image is fun (and appeals to my inner Americans watcher). His close relationship with Natasha isn't negated by this, they're bffs throughout the film, she's the cool aunt for the kids and is friends with his wife, and as someone who adores platonic m & f friendships I'm 100% on board with this. Now a wife Clint's in love with, has three children by and who totally supports him (with no sign of wanting to leave him due to his job) can't be removed as an obstacle to anyone's ship of choice easily, but fandom has practice and is probably going to retcon her and the children out of existence or kill them off anyway, but I hope for some brave souls actually writing Clint the family man as well.
(Sidenote: does Natasha's conversation with Mrs. Barton about the latest kid count as Bechdel passing, or does the fact Natasha finds out in said conversation that the kid isn't, as she thought, going to be a girl - and thus named after her - but a boy stuck with Nathaniel for a name negate the "not about a man" criterium? Anyway, Natasha's flashbacks to the Red Room include Madame B her instructor talking to her without any male person of any age mentioned. However, she doesn't have any conversations with Wanda or Maria Hill in the present.)
Still on a shipping note, Natasha/Bruce through the film I was okay with without emotionally connecting to it - though I had loved their scenes in the first Avengers movie - until the end when she threw him into the abyss after kissing him because getting the Hulk in that particular situation was more important than Bruce's feelings. That - which ended the romantic part of it - sold the relationship to me, because I'm weird like that. It's such a Natasha thing to do, and it satisfies my "I care about you, but I care about the mission/greater good/cause/issue of the day more" kink.
Mind you, Bruce had another reason to head towards the wilderness again at the end of this film, because his other big relationship is with Tony, and Tony seduces him into being mad scientists together not once but twice, and if the result of the second time was good damage control, the result of the first was terrible havoc for so many, and if I were Bruce, I'd run for the hills, too, before Tony could seduce me a third time with us maybe exploding the universe as a result. Seriously though, I loved the two persuasion scenes, and the fact Tony actually says "we ARE mad scientists - embrace it!" in the second one. (Incidentally, as opposed to the Oppenheimer actor, see review of play, RDJ does have the neccessary charisma to pull off the "engage, engage, do morally questionable science with me despite knowing first hand what that can result in!")
The newbies: I found the twins oddly bland, though given Wanda's decades long history of being Marvel's other doomed girl (after Jean Grey), I appreciate that it's Pietro who dies tragically, not her, and that she's the one who gets to join the new team at the end. Also, said comics history made me assume she'd be the latest version of the Jossian killer Ophelia type, but no, this Wanda actually isn't crazy. Has mind messing powers (as opposed to actually altering reality, which I can understand, because I thought making Wanda powerful enough in the comics to alter reality on a scale she can - notoriously "no more Mutants", for example - was a big mistake) in addition to telekinesis, but she's not insane. Maybe that contributes to the blandness, though. (Though I appreciate that the moment Wanda realises Ultron isn't just after the Avengers in general and Tony in particular but wants humanity as a whole gone, she (and Pietro) immediately switch teams instead of needing one of the heroes to persuade them.) Another thing: since Marvel isn't allowed to use the m(utant) word in the MCU, the twins had to get a different backstory, so in this film their powers came through artificial enhancements courtesy of the easily dispatched Hydra villain from the start, and their backstory has a different trauma, to wit, a first hand exposure to Tony Stark's weapons from his arms dealer days. So far, so good (err, in a manner of speaking), but you'd think the eventual pay off for this set up would be some type of confrontation scene involving Tony Stark near the end, but no. He never finds out the reason why Wanda picked him first to mindmess with.
Then again: he has other things to angst about. Majorly the part where Wanda pushing his paranoia forward results in him seducing Bruce into inventingSkynet Ultron together. Which not only is a big disaster for obvious reasons but has JARVIS as Ultron's first victim, and here's the movie death which did make me mourn (as opposed to Pietro's). Though JARVIS doesn't die (I'm not bothering with quotes around "die" because AI JARVIS so is a character in these movies) in the sense of being entirely gone as much as he becomes part of something new after Tony and Bruce manage to download him, err, it, into what becomes Vision. However, Vision, played by Paul Bettany or not, immediately points out that he's not JARVIS in human form, he's himself. So for all intents and purposes, on both a Watsonian and Doylist level, there's no more JARVIS, which would have hit me hard in any case, but after meeting the human Tony originally modelled him on in the first place it hits me doubly hard. RDJ does a great thing with Tony's physical stillness and facial expression throughout the scene when no one else but him has realised yet what happened to JARVIS, and then when he says Ultron already did kill someone...triple ouch.
And yet: Vision is the new character who really gripped me, despite his existence meaning that JARVIS is irrevocably gone. Basically he's the John Henry to Ultron's Skynet, if you allow me the obvious Sarah Connor Chronicles comparison, including the assumed family relation. And the quiet dignity, the curious innocence (which howevver isn't naiveté) and the matter of fact determination to see things through are all compelling to me. Both he and Ultron are created by Tony and Bruce and yet also create themselves and make their own decisions about who they are and what they do with their power, which makes for a thematic balance re: invention, I thought. And what can I say: as someone who loved many of Asimov's robot stories and TNG (with Data) as a teenager, I just imprinted on good Artificial Intelligence, okay?
Rolled my eyes at: "Peace in our time". There's just no way I can see anyone with the slightest sense of history use that phrase unironically and without awareness of the context, and for one of the few times, Tony's really not supposed to speak ironically (on a Watsonian level, of course he is on a Doylist level) when he uses it. It's on a level with First Class letting Charles use the phrase "they were just following orders" to Erik in clunkiness, and there is really no excuse for it as a scriptwriting failure.
Appreciated deeply: all the emphasis on civilian evacuation. I like this in all the Marvel movies, but here it really becomes the main mission, and given I recently watched the latest Zack Snyder trailer and bear a lasting grudge for him not letting Clark Kent/Superman OF ALL THE CHARACTERS waste the second of a thought on getting the fight away from people in Man of Steel, I appreciated this all the more. Seriously, say what you want about the Avengers, but these are characters who understand that getting people to safety has to become before beating the bad guy and act on this understanding, consistently.
Cameo appearances by supporting characters from other movies: Rhodey, Sam Wilson and Erik S. are the most obvious ones. Sam's mainly there to provide that line about chasing dead ends on the Quest For Bucky, but Rhodey actually gets some character bits to do, though not many, not surprising this is an overcrowded movie as it is. Erik S. gets to be supportive of Thor and show off his knowledge of Norse legends. But still, the fact they're there makes for good continuity - it answers the "if Disaster X is so bad, wouldn't you also call X for help?" question posed in previous movies.
Changing relations between Avengers: Natasha and Bruce, see above; also, Tony and Steve actually progress to friendship, so I bought it when Steve told Tony he'll miss him at the end of the movie. Unfortunately, given what storyline the MCU wants to do next, I suspect said progress was mainly there for that. Anyway, while I couldn't see MCU Steve/Tony after the first movie (because it's so very different from their comics type of relationship), the second one provides some basis if you're so inclined, including Natasha teasing Steve about "when you and Tony are finished gazing into each other's eyes". Thor - well, that would be spoilery, but let's just say there's a great pay off to the gag about Thor's hammer set up in the early scene which was released months ago where the Avengers try to move it in vain (except for Steve making it at least a bit wobble). So I'm curious whether Thor will have more interactions with SPOILER in future movies.
In conclusion: somewhere in the middle of my personal rankling of MCU movies, which is based on liking and thus entirely subjective.
kangeiko and naraht yesterday, which was lovely and included a brunch and a lengthy walk along the Thames respectively. I also watched Avengers: Age of Ultron. Non-spoilery version: I liked, though didn't love it the way i did the first movie. (Perhaps inevitable because getting-together-tales are a soft spot of mine.) Was tickled (by which I mean very amused) by some stuff that literally Josses lots of fanon, due to the fact that I wasn't keen or neutral towards said fanon. Rolled my eyes at one bit of dialogue, enjoyed lots of others (not surprisingly.) Because I watched it in close proximity to the Oppenheimer play , there were inevitable thematic overlaps for me. Was sad about SOMETHING which wasn't the something I expected. Do have a favourite among the new characters. Because I was/am in a grumpy non-shipper type of mood, the fact Joss managed to torpedo not one but several ships in a non-lethal way amused the hell out of me, especially since the mere existence of Clint/Coulson always mystified me. Due to being brainwashed for much of the first movie, Clint had been the Avenger in need of fleshing out anyway, and giving him a secret (except for Natasha and Nick Fury, both of whom knew) family contributed to doing it, not to mention that the absolute contrast to the longe wolf/lethal agent image is fun (and appeals to my inner Americans watcher). His close relationship with Natasha isn't negated by this, they're bffs throughout the film, she's the cool aunt for the kids and is friends with his wife, and as someone who adores platonic m & f friendships I'm 100% on board with this. Now a wife Clint's in love with, has three children by and who totally supports him (with no sign of wanting to leave him due to his job) can't be removed as an obstacle to anyone's ship of choice easily, but fandom has practice and is probably going to retcon her and the children out of existence or kill them off anyway, but I hope for some brave souls actually writing Clint the family man as well.
(Sidenote: does Natasha's conversation with Mrs. Barton about the latest kid count as Bechdel passing, or does the fact Natasha finds out in said conversation that the kid isn't, as she thought, going to be a girl - and thus named after her - but a boy stuck with Nathaniel for a name negate the "not about a man" criterium? Anyway, Natasha's flashbacks to the Red Room include Madame B her instructor talking to her without any male person of any age mentioned. However, she doesn't have any conversations with Wanda or Maria Hill in the present.)
Still on a shipping note, Natasha/Bruce through the film I was okay with without emotionally connecting to it - though I had loved their scenes in the first Avengers movie - until the end when she threw him into the abyss after kissing him because getting the Hulk in that particular situation was more important than Bruce's feelings. That - which ended the romantic part of it - sold the relationship to me, because I'm weird like that. It's such a Natasha thing to do, and it satisfies my "I care about you, but I care about the mission/greater good/cause/issue of the day more" kink.
Mind you, Bruce had another reason to head towards the wilderness again at the end of this film, because his other big relationship is with Tony, and Tony seduces him into being mad scientists together not once but twice, and if the result of the second time was good damage control, the result of the first was terrible havoc for so many, and if I were Bruce, I'd run for the hills, too, before Tony could seduce me a third time with us maybe exploding the universe as a result. Seriously though, I loved the two persuasion scenes, and the fact Tony actually says "we ARE mad scientists - embrace it!" in the second one. (Incidentally, as opposed to the Oppenheimer actor, see review of play, RDJ does have the neccessary charisma to pull off the "engage, engage, do morally questionable science with me despite knowing first hand what that can result in!")
The newbies: I found the twins oddly bland, though given Wanda's decades long history of being Marvel's other doomed girl (after Jean Grey), I appreciate that it's Pietro who dies tragically, not her, and that she's the one who gets to join the new team at the end. Also, said comics history made me assume she'd be the latest version of the Jossian killer Ophelia type, but no, this Wanda actually isn't crazy. Has mind messing powers (as opposed to actually altering reality, which I can understand, because I thought making Wanda powerful enough in the comics to alter reality on a scale she can - notoriously "no more Mutants", for example - was a big mistake) in addition to telekinesis, but she's not insane. Maybe that contributes to the blandness, though. (Though I appreciate that the moment Wanda realises Ultron isn't just after the Avengers in general and Tony in particular but wants humanity as a whole gone, she (and Pietro) immediately switch teams instead of needing one of the heroes to persuade them.) Another thing: since Marvel isn't allowed to use the m(utant) word in the MCU, the twins had to get a different backstory, so in this film their powers came through artificial enhancements courtesy of the easily dispatched Hydra villain from the start, and their backstory has a different trauma, to wit, a first hand exposure to Tony Stark's weapons from his arms dealer days. So far, so good (err, in a manner of speaking), but you'd think the eventual pay off for this set up would be some type of confrontation scene involving Tony Stark near the end, but no. He never finds out the reason why Wanda picked him first to mindmess with.
Then again: he has other things to angst about. Majorly the part where Wanda pushing his paranoia forward results in him seducing Bruce into inventing
And yet: Vision is the new character who really gripped me, despite his existence meaning that JARVIS is irrevocably gone. Basically he's the John Henry to Ultron's Skynet, if you allow me the obvious Sarah Connor Chronicles comparison, including the assumed family relation. And the quiet dignity, the curious innocence (which howevver isn't naiveté) and the matter of fact determination to see things through are all compelling to me. Both he and Ultron are created by Tony and Bruce and yet also create themselves and make their own decisions about who they are and what they do with their power, which makes for a thematic balance re: invention, I thought. And what can I say: as someone who loved many of Asimov's robot stories and TNG (with Data) as a teenager, I just imprinted on good Artificial Intelligence, okay?
Rolled my eyes at: "Peace in our time". There's just no way I can see anyone with the slightest sense of history use that phrase unironically and without awareness of the context, and for one of the few times, Tony's really not supposed to speak ironically (on a Watsonian level, of course he is on a Doylist level) when he uses it. It's on a level with First Class letting Charles use the phrase "they were just following orders" to Erik in clunkiness, and there is really no excuse for it as a scriptwriting failure.
Appreciated deeply: all the emphasis on civilian evacuation. I like this in all the Marvel movies, but here it really becomes the main mission, and given I recently watched the latest Zack Snyder trailer and bear a lasting grudge for him not letting Clark Kent/Superman OF ALL THE CHARACTERS waste the second of a thought on getting the fight away from people in Man of Steel, I appreciated this all the more. Seriously, say what you want about the Avengers, but these are characters who understand that getting people to safety has to become before beating the bad guy and act on this understanding, consistently.
Cameo appearances by supporting characters from other movies: Rhodey, Sam Wilson and Erik S. are the most obvious ones. Sam's mainly there to provide that line about chasing dead ends on the Quest For Bucky, but Rhodey actually gets some character bits to do, though not many, not surprising this is an overcrowded movie as it is. Erik S. gets to be supportive of Thor and show off his knowledge of Norse legends. But still, the fact they're there makes for good continuity - it answers the "if Disaster X is so bad, wouldn't you also call X for help?" question posed in previous movies.
Changing relations between Avengers: Natasha and Bruce, see above; also, Tony and Steve actually progress to friendship, so I bought it when Steve told Tony he'll miss him at the end of the movie. Unfortunately, given what storyline the MCU wants to do next, I suspect said progress was mainly there for that. Anyway, while I couldn't see MCU Steve/Tony after the first movie (because it's so very different from their comics type of relationship), the second one provides some basis if you're so inclined, including Natasha teasing Steve about "when you and Tony are finished gazing into each other's eyes". Thor - well, that would be spoilery, but let's just say there's a great pay off to the gag about Thor's hammer set up in the early scene which was released months ago where the Avengers try to move it in vain (except for Steve making it at least a bit wobble). So I'm curious whether Thor will have more interactions with SPOILER in future movies.
In conclusion: somewhere in the middle of my personal rankling of MCU movies, which is based on liking and thus entirely subjective.