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selenakThe Long, Twilight Struggle
This is one of those episode which I've only watched twice before, not because it's not excellent, but because emotionally, it's really gutting. Under current rl worldpolitical circumstances more than ever. Because I've seen it only twice before, I had forgotten a few details, such as the fact the chief commander of the Narn forces is G'Kar's uncle, or Refa stroking the red velvet of the Imperial Throne coveteously. (So looking forward towards two particular s3 scenes, I can't tell you!) Incidentally, I never noticed before, but the episode providing an excuse as to why Emperor Cartagia isn't in the opening scene (presumably for the Doylist reason that they hadn't cast Cartagia yet) contrasts with the episode not giving us any reason as to why Na'Toth isn't with G'Kar (when she really should be, ic), and that this never struck me before says something about the diminished presence of Na'Toth 2.0. in this season. Now, season 5 will provide us with an explanation as to where Na'Toth was in the final days of the Narn/Centauri war, and why hence she couldn't be with G'Kar, but a one line version of this could have been worked into the dialogue of this episode.
This one nitpick aside, it truly is superb. Andreas Katsulas and Peter Jurrasik are on fire as actors. This truly is G'Kar's season, and there's a reason why that clip of Londo observing the use of mass drivers on the Narn homeworld - which uses no special effect other than Londo's mirrored face in the ship's window, and Peter Jurasik's facial acting - will be used in the ever changing credits mix for seasons 3, 4, and 5 consistently. And of course G'Kar in the council chamber near the end has become one of the most quoted scenes of the show. (Sidenote: one of the good things given how the episode puts one through the emotional wringer for the rewatching fan is knowing that both G'Kar and Londo couldn't, at that moment, possibly imagine just how Narn would become, spoiler, and yet the show through its masterful character development makes it feel right when it happens.) In terms of Londo's overall arc, his voicing his doubts about his "allies" to an unimpressed Refa and the way his face falls in the tag scene when hearing about the additional annexations sets up certain s3 developments re: Londo and Refa, but note that at this point, he still thinks the overall goal justified the awful means used so far, and of course it's clear even to a first time watcher that he's kididng himself if he thinks that he can just say goodbye to Morden and associates now that he has what he originally wanted. This is not how deals with the devil work, Londo.
Draal 2.0. isn't bad, and the change of appearance is called out on screen and explained, but I must say the melancholic dignity of Draal 1.0. to me was more endearing than the huffed pomposity of Draal 2.0. Otoh, Delenn's delight in seeing him again and Sheridan unwittingly speaking up a sentence too soon repeatedly were light touches in a dark episode, and it occured to me that Draal is the first Minbari who after noticing Delenn's half-human state does not only not disapprove but says "I like it", which must mean a lot to her.
Sheridan being presented with the Rangers - literally, I mean, Delenn feels not so much as if she's letting him in to a secret as like she's making him a cheer-up present - made me realise another thing I had forgotten was that he hadn't known about them yet until this point. Though he's still not told who leads them, what with Garibaldi saying "a friend".
Comes the Inquisitor
This episode's guest star, Wayne Alexander, is one of those actors who keeps showing in different identities at the same show, being different each time, and Sebastian won't be the last of them. (More in season 4.) Anyway: Mr. Sebastian, aka Jack the Ripper. I remember
jesuswasbatman disliking the overabundant use of Jack the Ripper in sci fi tv - the two other examples that immediately come to my mind are that he shows up in TOS, he shows up in Sanctuary, though the later was post B5 - , and I must admit I somewhat changed my mind about this in general, because as a much younger watcher, it didn't really hit me that using Jack the Ripper in most cases means using real life atrocities for a quick shock effect. I would argue that's not so in this particular case, but that's because of having watched the show in its entirety, which means I know the implicaton of the Vorlons using a serial killer (and let's face it, Jack the Ripper is probably the serial killer you can rely on most of your audience recognize by name at once when mentioned) was entirely intentional.Back in the day, my problem with the episode was something else, which was that I didn't see how Delenn willing to sacrifice her life for Sheridan should work as a test of her prioritizing the lives of others over her own sense of destiny, of her - and Sheridan - doing "the right thing for the right reasons". (Sidenote: I wonder whether JMS had read T.S. Eliot's "Murder in the Cathedral" before writing tihis? Because Becket's last temptation is sacrificing his life but for the wrong reasons, i.e. gain eternal fame as a martyr, and resisting this is far harder than resisting going back to his privileged position as Henry's friend etc.) Delenn's willingness to be with the dying Markab in order to help them, regardless of her not knowing whether or not she will be infected as well, two episodes earlier: that proved she qualified. If she had died there with the Markab, it truly would have been "in the dark", leaving her a footnote to history. But she and Sheridan have befriended and are now ever more obviously in love with each other. Sacrificing your life for a friend or lover is something a good many otherwise villainous characters would also be capable of. So to me as a first time watcher, the narrative pay off and justification for the torture wasn't there, because I thought Kosh should have known from Delenn's Markab related actions already, and I must admit I did not ask what in retrospect is the obvious question: what does it say about the Vorlons that they preserved a serial killer to "interrogate" their potential allies, and that they expect them to put up with this? So the entire main plot felt a lot like h/c shippery fanfiction to me back then.
Now, even then, I did appreciate that the depiction of the torture was as non-gratitioius as you can make it while being clear on the fact it is torture. Especially given Sebastian's identity. It doesn't feel like torture porn - Delenn remains fully clothed, you never get a sense of male gaze, or that the staging would be different for male character. Moreover, in addition to introducing the central Vorlon question - "Who are you?", which is their catch phrase as "What do you want?" is the Shadows' - it does provide some Delenn character investigation, and not in her ability to withstand torture - how central is her sense of destiny to her being? When she says "if I fall, others will take my place", I think it's not something we've heard Delenn say before, certainly not when her colleagues in the Grey Council questioned her need to fulfill the prophecy herself. So while we've already seen Delenn's willingness to sacrifice herself for strangers in a non-destiny-related way two episodes previously, we haven't yet seen that Delenn's belief in herself comes with awareness she's not the only one able to fulfill the role she sees herself fulfilling, if the necessity arises.
What hasn't changed from my first watching to my rewatching now: my choice of "best and most devastating scene in this episode": it's, of course, Vir and G'Kar in the elevator. "Dead dead dead...." I can't think of another show which does something comparable. Because on the one hand, Vir apologizing shows himself as the good person we've gotten to know him as. But on the other, the show refuses the easy emotional pay off, because we're past "I'm sorry" (the one thing the late Emperor Turhan wanted to tell G'Kar) now, and the enormity of what happened and still happens means actions are required in addition to words. (BTW: Vir the Centauri being the one non-Narn person in the Zocalo who truly hears G'Kar's speech and decides to act on it is also a beautiful narrative irony.) And the gesture of G'Kar cutting into his hand, the blood drops, it's a perfect, gut wrenching visual. Now think back to the start of the show, with bumbling Vir the comic relief and G'Kar the somewhat smug also often comic relief villain in Midnight at the Firing Line - would any first time viewer have predicted a scene like this for them?
Trivia: in the version of the episode as originally broadcast, JMS committed a famous gaffe in his script by letting Sheridan name the London West End instead of the East End. This was redubbed by Bruce Boxleitner later on, but the first DVDS that were released evidently used the original episode print, and thus the last time I rewatched tihs episode, on dvd, it had "West End", whereas the remastered version on Amazon Prime has "East End".
Lastly, a bit of spoilery speculation regarding Sebastian.
Who
are
you?
The next episode will reveal what the Vorlons look like to the younger races, and s5 will tell us the Vorlons did indeed genetically condition the younger races to see them that way. Given that Sebastian is presented as a (warped) religious person, it's therefore just about believable that seeing Angels reprimanding him and giving him a new mission would work (as in, him doing their bidding instead of him contiuing to carve up women the first chance he gets), but "maybe now they'll finally let me die" (as opposed to him wanting to continue as the Vorlons' chosen inquisitor) could be genuine repentance, since this isn't something the "seeing the Vorlons as higher beings" effect would produce.
Also: Kosh II, aka Ulkesh if you use the tie-in media information, abusing Lyta in early s4 looks pretty similar to what Sebastian does to Delenn here, and as I recall Delenn does find Lyta after such an event, but while Delenn is appalled, she doesn't make the connection, which it now strikes me is a missed chance.
The
Chosen
One
The other episodes
no subject
Date: 2022-04-04 05:22 am (UTC)I did prefer Draal 1.0 to Draal 2.0, and I was amused by the lampshading of "huh, he looks totally different!"
Sheridan and the Rangers: if I were Sheridan I would honestly be a little miffed that there was this Sekrit Organization that everyone seemed to know about but me! I would have been more likely to be all "umm, I need a moment and also NOT HAPPY with you guys right now" rather than make a stirring speech. (
So, Inquisitor. I felt like this was a very weird episode.
Me: There's this big war they're preparing for and suddenly it's like "oh btw you might be a traitor?" Not convinced.
*watches more*
Me: Ohh, doing things for the right reasons. Sure, I can see being worried about that with Delenn. But then why wasn't Kosh worried about this like a year ago?
But yeah, like, the Vorlons are conscripting serial killers to torture people to see whether they're good enough and that's... a thing they do, huh? I'm totally lost here, but I figured it was because, well, Vorlons.
The Markabs: I have this whole headcanon here that Delenn knew she'd be at about as great risk inside as outside the quarantine zone (since it's canon that Franklin and Garibaldi had already ascertained that the air in the station was recirculated enough that everyone was going to be exposed -- I can't remember whether it is canon that she knew that) so she wasn't risking her life more than before in a meaningful way, and she might well have been doing the right thing for the wrong reasons. (That is, because she knew it was "expected" of her, as a priest Minbari, to do the self-sacrifice sort of thing -- I am betting that if I am still remembering Draal talking about the third principle of sentient life and how it didn't apply to Delenn, she's remembering it even more.) Although the gut-wrenchingness of that episode was how it became the right reasons in the end -- and so it's still true that it should have counted, and counted more than her being willing to save John. But maybe Kosh didn't, somehow, realize that. (I don't really understand what Kosh does and doesn't know.)
I also got from the episode that it's not that Delenn is willing to die for John (which as you say doesn't really distinguish her from anyone), it's that she's willing to concede that she, herself, might not be important.
Or, well, as you say, we haven't yet seen that Delenn's belief in herself comes with awareness she's not the only one able to fulfill the role she sees herself fulfilling, if the necessity arises. But yes, I would have been happier if it hadn't been John she offered to die for.
Jack the Ripper: Welp, I was definitely not expecting *that*! (Though hilariously, when he was going around declaiming while torturing Sheridan, I was all "Who IS this guy and why is he prancing around so much??") But I thought it actually worked, with the Ripper murders a shorthand for "this is the kind of person the Vorlons picked for this job" (with "this job" being both a proclivity for torture but also a penance as a long search for one who did not share his qualities) rather than for shock value in and of itself. Also, I do notice the initials on Jack Sebastian there, which I thought was interesting (and which further makes me think that the show is trying to do something a bit more complex with it).
On West/East End: I watch with subtitles, and the subtitle still says "West End," but the dubbing definitely says East End, which I was bemused by, so thanks for clearing that up :)
no subject
Date: 2022-04-04 07:28 am (UTC)I was hoping you wouldn't quit while understanding the temptation. As I said, even in better times, I shied away from rewatching this one except for one time, so this was only my third viewing in totem, which isn't true for the majority of B5 episodes. But it is so good and crucial to the show that it is a must.
if I were Sheridan I would honestly be a little miffed that there was this Sekrit Organization that everyone seemed to know about but me!
LOL. Well, he can console himself with the fact Ivanova didn't know, either, I guess. Though I like
But yeah, like, the Vorlons are conscripting serial killers to torture people to see whether they're good enough and that's... a thing they do, huh? I'm totally lost here, but I figured it was because, well, Vorlons.
Let's just say we'll discuss this again in early season 4.
Although the gut-wrenchingness of that episode was how it became the right reasons in the end -- and so it's still true that it should have counted, and counted more than her being willing to save John. But maybe Kosh didn't, somehow, realize that
Possibly. It's also worth pointing out that Kosh's stint on B5 is the first time since quite a while that a Vorlon has prolonged contact with a variety of the younger races. (As opposed to doing what they did with Sebastian - observe from a distance, grab, leave.) He's basically a grimmer version of Gandalf hanging out with the Hobbits as opposed to staying at Isengard a la Saruman. Which could influence his sudden lack of certainty re: Delenn, i.e. maybe he suddenly wonders whether he hasn't been too easy on her.
...or not. Maybe it's not Kosh at all but the other Vorlons; after all, he is the Vorlon Ambassador, with the job to represent his people, regardless as to whether or not something is his individual opinion.
Jack the Ripper: Welp, I was definitely not expecting *that*!
Me neither, back in the day, but I was expecting him to be someone, or else what would have been the point of making this character a 19th century human?
But I thought it actually worked, with the Ripper murders a shorthand for "this is the kind of person the Vorlons picked for this job"
Yes, same here, and that's why someone like, say, the main guest star from the s1 episode Death Walker, who is a fictional war criminal/mad scientist/serial killer would not have had the same immediate effect on an audience.
On West/East End: I watch with subtitles, and the subtitle still says "West End," but the dubbing definitely says East End, which I was bemused by, so thanks for clearing that up :)
The gaffe caused a lot of ridicule back in the day as I recall, because the social difference between West End and East End was enormous. (Hence G.B. Shaw's famous dark one liner about the Ripper murders, that Jack the Ripper managed what he and dozens of other socially minded journalists could not, bring the conditions of the East End to public attention.)
no subject
Date: 2022-04-04 07:51 pm (UTC)It's when she says "if I fall, others will take my place" - she understands that destiny exists. She will fight with all she has, but she will not fear her own death, because she knows others will pick up the banner - not even because she has handed it to them, but because they understand and accept the need.
She is confident that she has a destiny of her own, but there is a greater over-arching story of which she is only a part.
And that is why Sebastian is chosen to be the one to test her - he believed he had a destiny and he was wrong. And he was wrong because he believed it was he and he alone who could carry it out. (that and being an evil bastard) He was primed to spot those in it for self-glorification and to hate them.
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Date: 2022-04-05 02:33 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2022-04-05 08:07 pm (UTC)Delenn being willing to give up her life for Sherridan would not make her unique.
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Date: 2022-04-05 11:18 pm (UTC)Re Delenn and the Markab, I don't think she really feared that she'd get the disease, but I think that she quite unselfishly wanted to nurse people regardless of whether it meant having to deal with shit and vomit and possibly watch people die. Which is heroic in a less splashy and ostentatious way than enduring Seb's torture.
no subject
Date: 2022-04-07 02:10 pm (UTC)I‘m glad your father gave the show another chance. Also I suspect the placing of this episode isn‘t a coincidence, given how we will see Kosh in the next one…