Wither Cordelia?

[selenak]

When I bore everyone praise the fourth season of Angel as my favourite and as the best written one overall (if you take the entire season, from start to finish, not just parts), I often hear the objection "yes/maybe, but I am a Cordelia fan, and what they did to her...". Now, this never fails to puzzle me, because I was a Cordelia fan, and to me, the damage was always done in season 3; 4, again, to me, was if anything a salvage operation because the Jasmine retcon explained Cordelia's s3 behaviour in a way I could stomach, and turned it into the part of a Greek tragedy. However, thinking the matter through, it occured to me that the problem of the writing for Cordelia actually might predate both seasons.



From s1 of BtVS to the end of s1 of AtS, Cordelia was developed consistently, and on an ongoing basis. Of course, she was a main character on AtS and one of a larger ensemble on BTVS, but the groundworks were laid on Buffy. By the time Cordy moved to Los Angeles, she had already gone from the high school movie cliché in the BTVS pilot (bitchy high school queen) to three dimensional character one laughed and cried with, not at, had essentially performed the truthteller function in the ensemble (i.e. the character who says out loud what some of the others might think but wouldn't - later, Anya and Spike at different points would get the job on BTVS, and Jayne who is in many ways the early Cordelia gets it on Firefly) and had shown courage and endurance a plenty. But she still had joined Buffy & Co. because she wanted to stay alive and not end as vamp fodder, not because she saw fighting the good fight as something worth doing by itself.

The first season of AtS, with Cordelia as one of the three regular characters with that much more focus, took this up and presented a strong character arc for her; it also confronted her with her past thoughtless cruelties and showcased how her bluntness and sharp tongue were an asset if used to cut to the, no pun intended, chase instead of humiliating others. Cordelia went from the girl who joined Angel in the pilot mostly because again, she wasn't stupid and it was safer, and she had no friends in Los Angeles, to someone who, by the end of To Shanshu in L.A., had come to see the whole rescuing people business as her mission, not just an adjunct of Angel's or a way to make cash. The arc from material girl to heroine (with ongoing fondness for shoes) was complete.

And therein, I think, was the problem for the writers.

Season 2 saw Cordelia take a back seat for about two thirds, because the Darla arc was the core of it. She was still witty, strong, and after Angel had fired everyone, bonded even more with Wesley and Gunn... but. Look at the others. Angel during season 2 of course had the Darla arc, that was his main storyline. Wesley went from Faithful Servant!Wesley to Leader!Wesley. Gunn went from the guy who occasionally helped but didn't really know these people very well to becoming part of a new family, with Wesley and Cordelia and ended up choosing this new community over the old one. (And, alas, was doomed to repeat this storyline a couple of times during the next seasons, but that's another story.) Cordelia, basically, got Pylea, during the last third of the season. In which she was given the possibility to get rid of the visions and become what she had once been nicknamed, a princess, but chose the mission. Which is fine, except, well, hadn't she already done that during the last season finale? And really, what kind of alternative was a dimension that looked like a bizarro Ren Faire?

One more observation about Cordelia in s2. Leaving Pylea aside, she is showcased in two episodes; the early First Impressions, which is before the Darla arc kicks in and which is really about reintroducing Gunn and his background to the viewers, and Disharmony, just after the Darla arc has ended. Disharmony is a good Cordelia episode; it presents her with someone who is in some ways a shadow self, or an old self, much like Cordelia herself had been for early Buffy, it paints some pointed parallels, on a comedic level, to what has been happenening with Angel and Darla through the season, and thus helps Cordelia, who, true to form (ask Xander Harris) has been the one team member not so willing to forgive Angel after his return to the fold, to accept her old friend back.

And then we get the last scene.

Which is basically a punchline scene. Wesley lectures Angel that he still can't expect Cordy to come around that quickly, that he'll have work to do, Cordy comes in, realizes Angel has bought her a set of new clothes, bounces and has her arms around him in a heartbeat. On one level, it's funny, and it works because one of the things we love about Cordelia is that heroine or not, she still is the material girl as well (she is just not only that). On another, in retrospect and looking at developments from this point onwards, heralds several things:

1) Cordelia does not call Angel on his crap anymore (or if she does, as when a pregnant Darla shows up, it will be presented as for the wrong reasons and/or funny because of the inappropriateness of the reaction, not as blunt insight spelling out the truth)

2) Angel privileges Cordelia over the rest of his friends

3) The tight bond Cordelia formed with Wesley and Gunn during their months alone is not shown as important to her as her relationship with Angel; it might as well not have happened (any scene between Cordelia and Wesley post-Disharmony could as well have happened pre-Reunion without this making a difference).

In summation: s2 ended with Cordelia having been mostly at a standstill, in comparison to the other characters; when she did get some belated development, she essentially repeated a decision she already made. The one new thing was the hint of change between her and Angel.

You know, it's very hard not to imagine a story conference between s2 and s3 going "hm, what on earth shall we do with Cordelia...? I know! let's make her and Angel fall in love!"

As s3 turned out to be David Greenwalt's last season as executive producer, I'm tempted to ascribe that one to him, but regardless who had the actual idea, Joss was the overall boss, and thus it's his responsibility that the execution sucked. No offense to C/A'shippers. It never was my pairing of choice, but I've seen it pulled off in fanfic written pre- s3 in a believable and moving way. For starters, said fanfic did not feel the need to change Cordelia in a saint and uberwoman to accomplish the trick.

There are flickers of Cordelia being tactless and no-nonsense in s3, there are scenes like her conversation with Lilah in Billy or her and Wesley parodying Angel and Buffy for Fred's and Gunn's benefit. By, and large, though, we get it hammered into us that Cordelia is nothing less than the most wonderful woman on earth and the only one suitable for Angel. Fred, Lorne, in the end even Groo and Cordelia's mirror image, for Joss' sake, tell her (or Angel) how they are so absolutely perfect for each other and really, really, loved each other, not as friends but as lovers. It's not enough that Cordelia learns how to fight, no, she has to become part-demon, too, and develop special powers. Evil life-sucking creatures flee when she glows; in a scene that is the only one I can't stand in what is otherwise one of my favourite episodes, Benediction, and which is really only bearable if keeing the s4 Jasmine revelation in mind, she "detoxes" Connor. (Because, you know, Connor's issues aren't something emotional, they're like mild radiation, they just need a cure.)

And then there's the scene which put me off Cordelia for a long, long time. To wit, Fred asking Cordelia to intercede between Wesley and Angel, as she's their oldest friend, and ends her plea with "imagine how Wesley must feel right now?" Cordelia replies: "I don't care how he feels right now, the only feelings I care about are Angel's."

Cordelia pissed off to the max at Wesley for the kidnapping stunt, no matter his motives, I could have understood. Cordelia showing up at Wesley's doorstep to tell him in no uncertain terms that much, absolutely. But Cordelia plain ignoring Wesley - that was just too much. It also is my final piece of evidence of Cordelia in s3 showing the signs of being written like really bad fanfic, in which the OTP is only concerned for each other and all other relationships fade in the background and are ignored not just by the OTP but by the writers as well.

(Which, btw, is not true for Angel in s3. It's not my favourite season for him writing-wise, either, but we're not supposed to see him as ideal or approve of many of his actions, which helps to no end, plus his scenes with Darla and later teenage Connor are fab.)

So, when David Greenwalt left AtS, he ended his run with Cordelia ascended to divinity after a season in which she had been written more and more like a really bad fanfic version of herself, or, in even blunter words, a canon Sue. At which point Joss moved over Steven DeKnight from BTVS, where the later had just penned some of the darkest episodes of the show, to AtS. And of course one of the writers/producers who had been absolutely crucial in shaping AtS from the start, Tim Minear, had never left. Again, it's easy to imagine storyline conferences between seasons with the question "what on earth do we do with Cordelia now?". Other than letting her descend again, because obviously, you can't have a regular who isn't really there. It must have been obvious that the St.Cordy/Angel thing had not exactly worked, but both the sanctification and the not-quite-romance had happened. They couldn't be ignored.

They could, however, be retconned as being motivated by a Power who had hijacked Cordelia for her own purposes and was influencing her more and more.

This actually worked with the innate distrust all of Joss Whedon's created universes display against authorities and higher powers. It provided a villain for the season, and it gave an explanation for Charisma Carpenter's pregnancy, once they knew they had to deal with it as well.

wisdomeagle has written a great post on Cordelia in s4 - and I agree with her that here was actually a Cordelia there; the Jasmine takeover happened gradually in 4, which, as always imo, made it far better writing than the sanctification in s3 - so I would like to point all readers there for a detailed take on Cordy and her presentation in that season. However, much as I am enamoured with the fourth season and all its aspects, I must return to what is the theory at the core of my ramblings. Because being taken over by a higher Power and losing the struggle against her does not qualify as character development, either. Nor does s5's You're Welcome, the last Cordelia episode, which gives her a proper exit. It's a love letter to the character and the actress, but I can never be quite as charmed by it as most other people seem to be. I'm extremely grateful that in this episode, the writers finally remembered she cared about people other than Angel. It was lovely to see her "kicking it old school" with Wesley (and having the wish to do so for her last few hours on Earth, just as much as she wants to help Angel), and to tell him how sorry she is about Lilah).

But as much as I enjoy the Cordy lovefest, I don't think the premise works out. So supposedly TPTB owed her (for the visions, for Jasmine) and granted her this last favour... to reinspire Angel. The effect of Cordelia's intervention was that Angel remained at W&H instead of calling it quits and, as we discover later, finds out about the Black Thorn Circle, so he can take it out. Okay, fine. I can see that working within the mythology of the show and the war between TPTB and the Senior Partners. But the way this inspiring works seems to be mainly via winning a slashy duel with Lindsey, and given Lindsey never was much of a threat to Angel (a foil, yes, but the most devastating blow Lindsey ever landed against Angel was bringing in Dru to sire Darla, and that plan seems to have been something Holland Manners had come up with), I don't quite see why this convinces Angel again he's fighting the good fight at W&H's. I suppose you could say that Cordelia's presence, her affection and honesty inspires him, but given she never says anything about W&H being a good idea (rather the contrary), I still don't see how this connects to staying at W&H. I suppose we really have to use the vision transfer and the awareness of the Black Circle as an explanation, and this news arrives so much later I can't tie it emotionally with the episode. And of course, it never fails to jar me that Cordelia can just cheerfully ask Angel where Connor is. I can fanwank it - she's already dead, ghosts deal with trauma in a different way, or maybe that question is part of her attempt to bring Angel back to himself - but it still makes me blink each time, because what happened between Connor and Cordelia, and the results for both of them, was just too much for her to blithely ask about him as if he had never been anything but that baby from s3 to her.

But then again: it ties with the rest of the writing problem. No, it's not that they hated the character. It's that they loved Cordelia... and then had no idea what to do with her once she had spoken her last lines in To Shanshu in LA. Hold her on standstill, make her go saintly, make her into Angel's love interest, make her into the instrument of Jasmine - all try outs. But they never quite came together.

This, more than anything else, is the tragedy of Cordelia.


Postscript: Just for the record, I don't see this as gender-related. You can make similar points about Gunn post-s2 and until s5, when he finally gets a new, juicy and logical character line. Or even about Xander post s3. But the various attempts for Xander and for Gunn jell in retrospect in a way the ones for Cordelia don't.

Comments

[pjferret.livejournal.com]

I hadn't noticed the standstill thing in s3, but now that you mention it, I can see what you mean. They definitely didn't concentrate on her as much in that season as they did other characters. And once they did the higher being thing, it was like they just didn'tknow what to do with her anymore. But even before then, the St. Cordy act was starting to annoy me. That's not the Cordy I loved, not at all.

You're Welcome, while a nice send-off, always seemed a bit forced to me. Like they were trying to hard to fit her in and give everyone closure before killing her for good. I would have liked a long arc for her return, over more than just the one episode, so they could make her purpose for returning more realistic. But at the same time, I was a C/A fan, so the kiss made up for the rest of it. *g*

Great essay. :) I enjoyed reading it. And there are probably a ton of typos in this, but the text in this comment box is so small on my laptop I can't tell. So apologies in advance. *g*

[selenak.livejournal.com]

I hadn't noticed it at first, either, but in retrospect, I did. Especially in comparison with Wesley, who got developed non-stop from mid-season 1 onwards.

[ide-cyan.livejournal.com]

It's that they loved Cordelia... and then had no idea what to do with her once she had spoken her last lines in To Shanshu in LA.

It strikes me that Cordelia Chase and Rose Tyler have something in common there.

[selenak.livejournal.com]

Hm, yes, I can see what you mean, with Parting Ways as Rose's Shanshu?

[ide-cyan.livejournal.com]

Yep.

[harriet-spy.livejournal.com]

On another, in retrospect and looking at developments from this point onwards, heralds several things:


I would just like to point out that I identified all these problems at the time. But did anyone listen to me? Noooooooooo.

[selenak.livejournal.com]

The fate of many a prophet. *g*

[harriet-spy.livejournal.com]

I really need a 'history will vindicate me' icon. Probably with Magneto on it. ;)

[likeadeuce.livejournal.com]

Oh, that's a really nice way to look at it, and I think it's an excellent point that similar things happened to Xander and Gunn, arc-wise.

That's not to say there wasn't anything to do with Cordelia after season 1, but they didn't figure out what it was. And as much as I love the comradely vibe among C/W/G while Angel is gone, you're right that we don't get much more of that after "Disharmony." This is one of those points where i sometimes forget to distinguish between canon and fic-world, where it's easy enough to extrapolate that this closeness continued and we just didn't get lots of scenes to show it. I certainly don't see any reason to believe that they DON'T continue to be close, and in fact there are quite a few lovely scenes between Cordelia and Wesley up to and including "Waiting in the Wings." And, since I tend to kind of watch right past the admittedly nauseous hit-you-over-the-head C/A shippage, and watch them play Buffy & Angel in "Fredless" six times in a row, my viewing is going to be a little warped. (Of course, I like think "Birthday" is a Cordy/Wes episode, which is a fairly strong argument that my viewing already IS a little warped).

I do think that season 4 helps to make sense of the characterization. That still doesn't change that I have trouble physically watching Cordelia in most of season 4. She's not in control of her own actions, and she doesn't act like the character I used to care about -- whereas in S3 (at least pre-return of Groo and abandonment of Wesley) I could still see snatches of her.

[selenak.livejournal.com]

That's not to say there wasn't anything to do with Cordelia after season 1, but they didn't figure out what it was.

Yes, exactly.

And as much as I love the comradely vibe among C/W/G while Angel is gone, you're right that we don't get much more of that after "Disharmony." This is one of those points where i sometimes forget to distinguish between canon and fic-world, where it's easy enough to extrapolate that this closeness continued and we just didn't get lots of scenes to show it.

Oh, I can believe it while reading fanfic. And I do want to believe it. Though I'm wondering whether there are stories which postulate the contrary - that they really did start to drift apart at that point?

[likeadeuce.livejournal.com]

well, there are stories that postulate Wes and Gunn are off somewhere screwing their brains out and don't pay attention to Cordelia *g* But I haven't seen anything that postulated "Disharmony" as a real breaking point -- I could believe it might be for Cordelia and Wesley, except that there's contrary canon of them being buddy-buddy and I don't know if Gunn would care enough to be offended by it. Incidentally, the introduction of Fred is generally blamed for breaking up the C/W/G dynamic but in canon that clearly DOES start earlier -- there are lots of scenes with Wes and Gunn and with Cordy and Angel together in the last part of the season, but hardly anything with the three. I suspect a lot of this is just an inadvertent result of juggling the ensemble.

But at some point, it's obvious that someone said, "Charisma is the female lead and obviously she should fall for Angel" -- which solves not only what-do-we-do-with-Cordelia but what must have been an equally vexing problem, who is Angel's canon love interest. (Pylea suggested they might have been going with Fred, but that clearly got scrapped early on in season 3). Now why he needs to have a love interest besides Darla, don't ask me, but somebody clearly decided that wasn't happening.

[kathyh]

the tragedy of Cordelia.

Masterly analysis as usual. I have a vague memory of Joss answering a complaint about the characterisation of Cordelia by saying that they wanted to show her as the opposite of Buffy, a girl who was given great power but failed to use it correctly. I may be misremembering but this always struck me as a retcon and I'm pretty sure your version is the correct one. Sadly they didn't know what to do with her, though the Angel romance might have worked if it hadn't been so botched.

[selenak.livejournal.com]

I never heard or read that one before, but yeah, it does sound like a retcon (and not of the sense making Jasmine kind).

[nolivingman.livejournal.com]

Excellent analysis. Cordelia's story makes me angry and sad in so many ways.

But Cordelia plain ignoring Wesley - that was just too much. It also is my final piece of evidence of Cordelia in s3 showing the signs of being written like really bad fanfic

Yes, that is the act that I have trouble getting past. I have fanwanked it as she was already messed up from her part-demon-ness, but it's an unsatisfying wank and I can't really think too much about it or it just falls apart. I'm glad they addressed the Cordy/Wes relationship in You're Welcome, but that episode was as you say a love letter and so disconnected from Wesley's arc that it made the Cordy/Wes reconciliation kind of unreal in a way to me. I can't explain it right, but it seemed like a moment out of time more than a part of the continuing arc of the show and so while I loved it, it didn't have the emotional resonance it should have had for me.

[selenak.livejournal.com]

it seemed like a moment out of time more than a part of the continuing arc of the show and so while I loved it, it didn't have the emotional resonance it should have had for me.

Same here. I wrote a bit more detailed about this, and which episode did have that resonance for me, here (http://selenak.livejournal.com/171882.html#cutid1).

[entrenous88.livejournal.com]

Found this via friendsfriends, and I really enjoyed reading your careful and considered take on this situation.

I've always loved Cordelia as a character, but I also was saddened when s3 marked a refutation of some of the things that had so defined her. I agree completely that the writers focused her on Angel to the detriment not only of her relationships with other characters, but to the detriment of her own character. It always made me uneasy that Cordy seemed in need of grave changes in order to make her relationship-ready for Angel.

Interestingly enough, when I wrote a number of Cordelia-focused fics as part of a seasonal character fest (spring-of-cordy) I asked for prompts but specified I wanted BtVS s1-3 and Ats 1-2 settings, but not after that point in canon. At the time I didn't want to go into the numerous reasons why I feel reluctant to write Cordy after that point. Your essay articulated a number of the reactions behind my impulse, and so it's been really edifying for me to read.

But I completely take your point here that the unravelling of the character began in s2. There are so many could-have-beens in which the writers might have taken a kernel of something and really worked it through for the character. You mentioned "First Impressions": I've always loved that ep as a Cordelia-focused arc too, and really, I was so disappointed that we didn't get more elaboration and development of the ways in which Cordy & Gunn's friendship specifically (not just the Cordy & Wes & Gunn relationship) unfolded as the series went on. Great start in that episode; not too much follow through for the characters' relationship.

Thanks for this.

[selenak.livejournal.com]

It always made me uneasy that Cordy seemed in need of grave changes in order to make her relationship-ready for Angel.

Quite. Like I said, C/A is not my relationship of choice (romantic, I love them as friends), but I did read a few stories as I recall where it worked. Those, however, worked with Cordelia as she had been pre-sanctification, and took the friendship as a basis, instead of going for the Two-Champions-Together route.

Gunn and Cordelia: yes, that was basically raised and then dropped after First Impressions. It's really strange that in the same season, not just Wesley as a character but Wesley's friendship with Gunn was developed and moved forward without a glitch.

[bruinsfan.livejournal.com]

It always made me uneasy that Cordy seemed in need of grave changes in order to make her relationship-ready for Angel.

Amen. Lord knows I've been one of the louder voices speaking against a Cordy/Angel romantic pairing since late Season 2, but I do think it could have been done in a satisfactory manner IF both Cordelia's characterization and the pre-existing tone of their friendship had been retained from earlier stories. Both Cordelia and Angel were somewhat insensitive, sarcastic, and vain characters who each served to point out the other's faults while retaining grumbly affection for each other. If they'd sort of accidentally fallen into a romantic relationship with horrified "I can't believe I'm doing this with you!" attitudes a la Sam and Diane on Cheers, it could have worked. Instead what we got was the former mercilessly blunt truth-teller spouting platitudes about how wonderful Angel was, and the dour loner who'd been a largely unsentimental second banana to his previous alpha-female loves (when he wasn't trying to kill them) getting all sappy and chauvanistically overprotective about Cordelia. Ugh.

[entrenous88.livejournal.com]

That's a nice description of how it could have been. From your words, I'm also thinking screwball comedy vibe (which really is what Sam & Diane were like in some ways).

And perhaps that was part of the problem. The writers were so unused to thinking of relationships for Angel in anything other than deadly serious tones (though I think there was more fun to be had, albeit of a *very* dark variety of fun whether we're dealing with Angelus or Angel, with Darla than with Buffy).

But Angel and Cordy really worked in the context of snark and banter, each raising eyebrows and checking the other's cherished self-delusions, both of them working to mirror what was more real in the other one even as they frustrated each other. It's just a more comic mode, and maybe the producers and writers couldn't figure how to make that work in a framework that's essentially noir.

I completely think it could have worked. But it would have entailed some shifts in the series itself, unless the end result (Cordy ascending) would have somehow worked out the same. Hard to imagine that outcome, though, since Cordelia wouldn't have been pitched to us in saintly-mode.

[bruinsfan.livejournal.com]

I think we saw hints of how it could have been done correctly in "Waiting in the Wings," perhaps the last time Cordelia read completely as herself to me. They were snarky and impatient with each other there, and managed to achieve hotness for the first and only time in 8 years of sharing the screen together.

I've maintained to my friends that that episode is a work of genius like unto "Once More, With Feeling," only instead of the genius actually making it onto the screen as a highly entertaining story, most of Joss' creative energy is instead spent on keeping the episode from falling into the event horizon of Boreanaz & Carpenter's negative romantic chemistry.

[callmesandy.livejournal.com]

Dude, we are so in agreement about that scene in Benediction. For me, s3 is a long slog from Darla's death to Connor's reappearance, but that scene in Benediction is one of two things in Ats land I actually fast forward. (Maybe three? Sometimes I really can't take the one where Gunn "sells his soul.") I fanwank in my head that there was some ooky Quortoth crap going on and that the glowy thing was direct Jasmine intervention. First contact with Dad? And certainly, it's not like Connor after that becomes more sweetness and light.

In my rewatchings, I've noticed that the C/A stuff, on Angel's side, seems to have started in s2. Note in the Groo/Angel fight in Pylea, Angel is cracking the sort of jokes about Angel that fit the Buffyverse "crushing/interesting romantically" mode. Where everything falls down is that Cordelia never responds until she becomes half-demon.

For me, along with the HORROR of that scene where she only cares about Angel's feelings, I would point to the completely un-Cordelia like moment in Waiting In The Wings where she talks to Fred about Angel and implies Angel is too good for her. Cordelia Chase wouldn't think anyone was too good for her. At any stage of development.

[selenak.livejournal.com]

Jasmine intervention is how I explain it to myself, too, and I've used that in fanfic.

Where everything falls down is that Cordelia never responds until she becomes half-demon.

Unless you think, as the writers probably want us to, that her entire attraction to and relationship with Groo is just transference of her burning and surpressed desire for Angel. *rolls eyes* But she certainly shows no signs of consciously responding before that.

Cordelia Chase wouldn't think anyone was too good for her. At any stage of development.

Amen!

[callmesandy.livejournal.com]

Even the fanwank can't make that Benediction scene tolerable, sadly. Ugh.

You know, I can see Groo as transference, but it seems like the writers screwed the pooch on making the viewers see it, if by viewers you mean most of us. The things that attracted Cordelia to Groo were the things that Angel did not have - that openness and easiness and how much he blatantly thought she was awesome.

What's sad about the scene in Waiting In The Wings is that just a few eps earlier, Cordelia's strong sense of self-worth is verified by Skip - he notes how her astral self is exactly who she is. They remembered in one place, and then Whedon writes an episode where Cordelia says more than once that she thinks she's not good enough or sexy enough for Angel. It's so OOC from her every previous appearance, it just buuuurns. :)

[elisi]

Very good! I think, sadly, that you're probably right.

Maybe... maybe they should have killed her at the end of S1 and given the visions to Gunn? ;)

[selenak.livejournal.com]

This would have solved the problem of Gunn's function in the overall narrative, too. But in my ideal world, they'd have found a way to write Cordelia such an interesting storyline as the one Wesley received.

[cordelianne.livejournal.com]

This is excellent! Thanks so much for sharing this. I definitely agree.

When I first watched AtS, I started during season 3 which I really enjoyed for the Angel, Wes and Connor stories but was really unimpressed with Cordelia's storyline. (My friends and I used to mock the whole "champion" and glowy thing.) It was my impression - from other fans' comments - that this was when people felt problems with Cordelia's character began. So when I got the first 2 season on DVD and watched them I was surprised to note a number of those issues which you discuss in this post.

I also feel that Charisma Carptenter is not the most versatile actress, she's not bad; she's just really good at the kind of role she played on BtVS, season 1 of AtS and as Kendall Casablancas on Veronica Mars.

Like you, I was pleased by the Jasmine retcon-ing in season 4. And I love this:

But then again: it ties with the rest of the writing problem. No, it's not that they hated the character. It's that they loved Cordelia... and then had no idea what to do with her once she had spoken her last lines in To Shanshu in LA. Hold her on standstill, make her go saintly, make her into Angel's love interest, make her into the instrument of Jasmine - all try outs. But they never quite came together.

This, more than anything else, is the tragedy of Cordelia.

[selenak.livejournal.com]

also feel that Charisma Carptenter is not the most versatile actress, she's not bad; she's just really good at the kind of role she played on BtVS, season 1 of AtS and as Kendall Casablancas on Veronica Mars.

Point. Though it has been pointed out to me that it is not fair to compare because the Cordy-taken-over thing happened gradually whereas the other examples are instant, but it's still a fact Charisma is the only actress/actor who didn't thrive when asked to play an alternate/evil version of her character, as opposed to David Boreanaz, SMG, or later Amy Acker (though Illyria isn't alternate, she's another character altogether).

[pandarus.livejournal.com]

Yes and Yes and Yes and Yes and Yes.

Very well put.

[violaswamp.livejournal.com]

Excellent analysis. All of these problems are fanwankable, so they don't stop me from loving AtS, but fanwanks are just that: ways to explain problems.

The problems you cite in S2, as well as the glaringly obvious ones in S3, are why I adore S4 and don't really mind what happens to Cordelia there. Because, as you say, S4 actually deals creatively with problems that were sown earlier in the show.

[selenak.livejournal.com]

Oh, these problems don't stop the AtS love for me, either. A tv work in progress is bound to have problems and flaws. It's not like you can do with it what you can do when writing a novel, go over the earlier chapters again when you see they need redrafting before the finished product makes sense. Though what they did in s4 comes as close as it is possible, given the medium...

[francis-eugene.livejournal.com]

Although I might have small issues with some elements of your presentation, it's generally right on target. An excellent essay.

However, I disagree somewhat with this:

In summation: s2 ended with Cordelia having been mostly at a standstill, in comparison to the other characters; when she did get some belated development, she essentially repeated a decision she already made.

I don't believe her real development was the re-affirmation of her decision.

At the end of season 1 she learned to care about "saving all the people", in a way a somewhat abstract and nebulous ideal (afterall, Angel's still doing most of the actual saving). But good for her, she's beginning to care about others and not just herself. Seaon 2 carries that even further to show how she cares about the people closest her, the people most real and concrete to her, to the point of putting their needs before her own.

Wisdomeagle (http://wisdomeagle.livejournal.com/) makes an issue of the beginnings of her deceitfulness at the end of season 2 (and into season 3) when she hides the dibilitating effects of the visions. But I don't see that lie of ommision as deceitful (which implies malice), but rather as a caring unselfish human who can finally put someone else's needs before her own. I see it as the final step in her transformation from shallow me-only cheerleader to a fully realized woman, capable of empathizing with the pain and problems of her friends, thinking of others first and foremost.

It's a sometimes slow and subtle development from the end of season 1, not brought to the forefront among all the stories being told (except "First Impressions"), but a real and important one, I think. At least up to the end of "Disharmony".

That (and all the C/A stuff in the last several episodes of season 2) is just plain ham-handed story-telling as the writers succumbed to the cliche of the two couragous, heroic (and gorgeous!) leads falling for each other. Blah!

[dlgood.livejournal.com]

much as I am enamoured with the fourth season and all its aspects, I must return to what is the theory at the core of my ramblings. Because being taken over by a higher Power and losing the struggle against her does not qualify as character development, either. Nor does s5's You're Welcome

I agree with this sentiment. S4's Cordelia arc, good as it is... seemed rooted in Damage Control. And YW was more a love letter than characterization.

Were it a bit more artful, the bones of the S3 storyline could have been held over as some sort of a basis for a story-arc detailing the dangers of fanaticism re:Cordelia's faith in the PtB and her visions, or even as some outgrowth of Cordy's psychological need to feel important. Namely, if the S3 arc had somehow been more directly/intentionally tied to a character flaw... much as Wesley's S3 descent was tied to character flaws revealed by his pursuit of a course of action that initially appeared to have good intentions.

The YW welcome story verdict seemed to be that Cordelia was merely an unwitting victim of Jasmine, but absent any deeper exploration of what this signified about her character traits, good and bad. Which is to say... why it was significant to her character.

[selenak.livejournal.com]

Were it a bit more artful, the bones of the S3 storyline could have been held over as some sort of a basis for a story-arc detailing the dangers of fanaticism re:Cordelia's faith in the PtB and her visions, or even as some outgrowth of Cordy's psychological need to feel important. Namely, if the S3 arc had somehow been more directly/intentionally tied to a character flaw... much as Wesley's S3 descent was tied to character flaws revealed by his pursuit of a course of action that initially appeared to have good intentions.

Very good point. I've been trying to think why Wesley's arc worked so well and Cordelia's didn't, and you put your fingers on it - Wesley's came from within.

[thalia-seawood.livejournal.com]

You are very right about Cordelia having grown up by the end of AtS, season 1. Usually, when a character has reached this level of growth, Joss kills/gets rid of this character. (Doyle, Tara, Fred) The character may come back, but will then have to face a different challenge. (I'm thinking of Buffy and Spike here who both grow so much - then die - and when they come back have to face reality anew. This is also what happens reg. the Angel/Buffy romance.)

It never was my pairing of choice, but I've seen it pulled off in fanfic written pre- s3 in a believable and moving way.
I checked some of my early Buffy reviews and I remember that I found Angel/Cordelia intriguing back then. Back then Cordelia was still unaware of Angel's true nature and was interested in him, because he was handsome and also Buffy's admirer. So at this point in the story, it would have been fun to see Cordy try to seduce him and then realise she's in over her head.
Of course, by the end of AtS, season 1, their character dynamic has already changed fundamentally. They have become close friends - and I loved that friendship.

It also is my final piece of evidence of Cordelia in s3 showing the signs of being written like really bad fanfic, in which the OTP is only concerned for each other and all other relationships fade in the background and are ignored not just by the OTP but by the writers as well.
Word! That's exactly it.

But the various attempts for Xander and for Gunn jell in retrospect in a way the ones for Cordelia don't.
I agree. Maybe it is because in both cases the writers found convincing character flaws for them, flaws that had been there before, but that hadn't been explored. Actually, regarding their flaws Gunn and Xander share a deep insecurity, the fear of not being good enough. Willow has similar flaw, of course, and it's lovely that all characters react in different ways in order to gain control.

It's that they loved Cordelia...
Yes! So the lesson of this appears to be for all writers/directors that the more you love a character, the more you have to tread carefully. Loving a characters means to give him/her believable flaws, to make them fail and have them get up again and learn and grow. But if you just start over-adoring them, they will end up like Cordelia - or Riley in "As You Were". :-) Uber-perfect and boring.

p.s. I hated Angel's fight with Lindsey and its slashy subtext. Thank heavens, Lindsey's death scene made up for it...

[selenak.livejournal.com]

Of course, by the end of AtS, season 1, their character dynamic has already changed fundamentally. They have become close friends - and I loved that friendship.

Me too, as you know.

p.s. I hated Angel's fight with Lindsey and its slashy subtext. Thank heavens, Lindsey's death scene made up for it...

"You kill me? A lackey? But... Angel! Angel kills me!" Ah, Lindsey. So convinced he's the archnemesis, and he just isn't.

[dudly-lajoie.livejournal.com]

*whistles*

That was one great essay. Now I know exactly where to start with my very healthy denial.

I never quite watched the BtVS or AtS episodes in order, so I thought it was -normal- for Cordy to be a lot of things she was, but the fact is, I watch the show mainly for the characters interaction, the friendships and the what-could-be-romantic (but-we-don't-want-it-to-be-because-we-know-if-it-becomes-canon-Joss-will-kill-it).

So yes. The Wes&Cordy friendship did really frustrate me. Because they are really great friends to watch. You see them flirt in Sunnydale. Become partners in season one. Being friends, being family, bickering. Trying to keep steady, holding on each other in a metaphor kind of way after the Angel-Fired-Us blow.

You get the really nice phone call in Reprise. Wesley's speech to Angel about Cordy in Epiphany. Then, you are so right, not much.

I really believe in the fact that Angel was her best friend, but he betrayed her, and Cordy sticks as someone who holds grudges.

And, hm. After that, the Wes and Cordy friendship gets really scarce. I personally like the fact that he has a picture of Cordy, Angel and himself in his wallet, just as Cordy has the same picture in a frame. And love the scene in Fredless. n__n But the whole "I don't care about his feelings" really -is- too much. *shakes head*

She should have gone to his apartment, scream his head off, go have a violent talk, use the excuse of him still being his boss, I don't know. Just acting on it.

But then again, maybe Wes should have considered buying her clothes. It worked for Xander and Angel.

And hey, aren't I a rambling little girl.

Ohhh! I just noticed that you're the girl who wrote the Cordy funeral/crossover with Six Feet Under! :D I reread that fic after having watched more Angel episodes. (Because as I said, I don't really watch them in order.) Liked it even more, what with things having more depth once you know where they came from.

(For instance, the Gunn and Wesley singing We Are The Champions. I hadn't watched S2 the first time I read the fic. Once I re-read it, it tugged at my heart real hard.)

Erm. Yeah. I'm a babbling idiot. Well, I'm off then! *skip away*

[selenak.livejournal.com]

Thank you for the thorough feedback - it's goot to know old essays are still read! May I ask how you came across it?

And oh, that photo. It was one of my favourite props the show used.

Yes, guilty as charged for the SFU crossover. Which all started with a prompt that went "Angel hires the Fishers to bury Cordelia" and then exploded in my head to become a big ensemble story on both sides and a chance to say farewell to a character I'm very fond of, problematic writing not withstanding.

[dudly-lajoie.livejournal.com]

I came across it... *tries to remember* I think it was Delicious.com. Yeah, I was looking for Cordy-related things. Fiction mostly, but I found few essays and archives and, yeah.

Yeah, that photo. XD What are your other favorite props, then?

I was a very good crossover. *nods* I'm a sucker for all things that go along the line of "Farewell Cordelia". n___n (I love the girl, really. But then, I like most character with confidence and snark, whatever the fandom)

[selenak.livejournal.com]

Props: oh, I also have a soft spot for Mr. Pointy (ak the stake Kendra gave Buffy which Buffy used for the rest of the show) and Mr. Gordo (Buffy's stuffed pigin the first few seasons; it's easy to lose sight of how young they were all supposed to be, and things like that were good reminders).