Nay and Yay

[selenak]

The Aged Parents versus Telecom feud continues, which unfortunately means (among other things) I have to do some of their correspondance as long as I still have online access, which means less time for fannish things. Hence my still owing two invented relationships (to deborah_judge and kangeiko) and ever more theatrical_muse stuff.

Briefly, re: Torchwood:



For something that was supposed to be a tearjerker, this left me strangely cold. Well, at least it gave Ianto more profile, and it did surprise me in that Ianto was not the one to kill Lisa in the end, which I thought was the obvious setup from the moment we saw her, but the thing is, I can't sympathize the way I need to for the story to work. Lisa's look is just one distracting irritation here. You know, Voyager did this with Seven of Nine, but the blatant transformation of the original Borg look to something, to use a bad euphemism, form-hugging somehow didn't annoy me, probably because I liked Seven, who was an interesting character and whose storylines did not revolve around her sexuality, despite her costume being obviously there for the boys. As for Lisa, there is no reason why she couldn't look like, say, Yvonne did than the obvious one. Which is why the one true horror moment for me was her in the Pizza Girl's entirely human body: now that was non-gratitious and it worked, because it showed that perhaps the most horrible thing about the entire affair wasn't that Ianto was wrong about Lisa still being there, but that he was right, there was Lisa, and she was willing to do this. If I had liked the episode better, I'd make a connection between the truly monstrous as human and love as selfishness possible themes, but I'm not sure that was at all intended.

My big problem, however: what Ianto did. I've seen comparisons in his favour to Rose in Dalek, which, sorry, I don't see at all. When Rose touched the Dalek, she had no idea what a Dalek was, as the Doctor had never bothered to tell her. She had just seen another being tortured in front of her (well, on the viewscreens). Her instinctive response - to help that being, to be appalled by the torture - was understandable, and sympathetic. Meanwhile, Ianto knew exactly what the Cybermen were, he had seen them in action. Yes, the transformation process had not been completed, and yes, he loved Lisa and did not want to give up on her. But he had to know that he had a potential time bomb endangering an infinite number of other people, and he didn't even make the most basic security measures. So my Ianto sympathies very very limited indeed.

These recent weeks, I've been also watching another new show, Dexter, starring Michael C. Hall (of Six Feet Under fame) in the title role and Julie Benz (playing the anti-Darla, one could say, and very well). Dexter, with the tricky premise of a main character who is a serial killer, and not in a metaphorical way (i.e. vampire), somehow manages within the same number of episodes to be far, far more compelling than Torchwood has been yet. I especially like the way the supporting characters have been fleshed out; people like La Guerta and Doakes, introduced as possible antagonists, come across as three dimensional, with their own storylines and rich emotional background. Rita, Julie Benz' character, is as said in her introduction damaged, but given a quiet strength and not at all the eternal damsel in distress. As for Dexter himself, he's not Hannibal Lector, which had been my first fear when reading the premise, and so far, the show has managed to avoid that other danger, which you could call the Vigilantism Yay! effect. (As Dexter kills other killers.) I'll probably write a post on the show so far, but for that I need time, time, time. And another hotel with online access.

Comments

[kathyh]

So my Ianto sympathies very very limited indeed.

I'm not sure how much you were supposed to sympathise with him by the end as it was very obvious he was completely wrong and had endangered everybody. Jack was unsympathetic, but right. The fact that Ianto couldn't kill her in the end even after what she'd done to pizza delivery girl, which was truly monstrous, was interesting and I'm sure will have repercussions. Basically he can't be trusted anymore.

I enjoyed this episode more than I have the others but Torchwood still has a way to go before it truly hooks me.

I'll watch out for Dexter. The combination of Michael C. Hall and Julie Benz is too tempting to resist.

[selenak.livejournal.com]

Oh, it's not that I'll stop watching, I mostly liked the other episodes and this one didn't bore me, but as yet, I feel no spark.

Re: Ianto, I'm tempted to write the "why isn't he fired at the end?" question off to the tv syndrome, as similar questions can be applied to many a character (I'm an Alias watcher and I love Jack Bristow dearly, but as it's clear he prioritizes his daughter above all else by the end of the very first season, the question of why the CIA continued to employ him remains open. And let's not even get into the rehiring of my Alias favourite Arvin Sloane...) Otoh, so far we've seen Jack let a serial killer loose to keep the Doctor's hand, Suzie kill people by glove, Owen use what has rightly been called the sci fi equivalent of a date rape drug. Ianto sort of fits in. *veg*

Re: Dexter, here is a to tempt you further:

http://buffyannotater.livejournal.com/539965.html

[kathyh]

Damn, that is tempting...*g*.

Otoh, so far we've seen Jack let a serial killer loose to keep the Doctor's hand, Suzie kill people by glove, Owen use what has rightly been called the sci fi equivalent of a date rape drug. Ianto sort of fits in. *veg*

He does. You have to wonder what Toshi is going to do to prove herself just as damaged a character as the others!

[timeofchange.livejournal.com]

Wish I could disagree with you re: Torchwood, but sadly, I have to say you are right. I really want to like Torchwood, but so far it's disappointing. Captain Jack leaves me cold, the plots are a bit hackneyed, and the kissing seems gratuitous. Are we supposed to be titillated or shocked by the boy-on-boy kissing? As it all seems rather soulless and lacking in passion, I can't say it does much for me. I'm willing to hang in there in the hope that the show will find itself, but I fear that it's going to be nothing more than a shallow exercise.

[selenak.livejournal.com]

As to the kissing, I suspect we weren't supposed to be shocked, but supposed to feel this fulfilled the pledge of "we're an adult show, with bisexual characters!". The problem was that these kisses don't come from relationships and thus appear gratuitous. The reason everyone went gaga back when about Jack kissing the Doctor in the s1 finale was because that kiss came out of a relationship we had seen. These kisses, so far, are coming from nothing.

This being said, I don't find Torchwood boring. It entertains me, and I'm interested enough to keep watching a while longer, but the last episode just didn't do much for me.

Re: Plus...

[buffyannotater.livejournal.com]

What I liked about the Jack/Ianto kiss was actually how the reason for it was revealed later, in what he said to Gwen--he really had worried that he would be killed by Lisa, and then, he never felt so alive. At the moment it happened, it was a bit out of the blue, but I liked the explanation. It might be the first time we've seen Jack actually scared for himself.

[londonkds.livejournal.com]

I only just realised who Michael C Hall is. I will definitely have to see Dexter if it ever makes it over here.

It's odd regarding Michael C Hall's career. He's so classically handsome and clean-cut in way that's unfashionable now, so it seems like they have to cast him in some role that subverts expectations of him as a matinee idol. Whether it's as a repressed gay man who's still spectacularly repressed even after coming out, or as a serial killer.

[selenak.livejournal.com]

Michael C. Hall: I'm just waiting for icons with him and Julie Benz to appear, boggling people's minds at the idea of David and Darla. *g* (Leaving the problem of sexual orientation aside, methinks Darla would have gone for Nate anyway, not David, though she would have killed him afterwards. Not just because she's a vampire but because she wouldn't have stood for the bullshit...)

Seriously now: he proves once more what a good actor he is. Dexter has a different body language from David, of course, and though one technically knows it's the same actor, there is no distraction from the story by being unable to believe him as this very different person.

As to why he picks these non-matinee idol roles, or they pick him: you're probably right, it's an attempt to subvert expections...

[shezan.livejournal.com]

Your parents have taken on DT? Brave people. What happened?

[selenak.livejournal.com]

Friday morning, and none of our computers in Bamberg can't get online. Only the rooter and the wireless and everything else works, just not the online access. Hours are wasted till Dad remembers that because the Telekom sent him the same bill twice last month (again, they did this for four months in a row), he sent one of them back with an explanation that he had already paid, and wouldn't pay twice.

So he calls and asks whether they cancelled our subscription. Turns out they have. Because of the unpaid bill. But, says Dad, I paid it. Which you have in writing. Also from copies from my account. Yes, but the person in charge is not there to clear up this misunderstanding, etc. By now, it's still not cleared up, and Dad keeps faxing them bills of his own for his working hours, due to lack of online access. He says he'll sue.

[shezan.livejournal.com]

You GO, Werner!!!

(No, seriously, I was amazed when I briefly lived in Munich that consumer service seems to be worse in Germany than in France. People in shops, etc; are nicer in Germany on the whole, but services, like cable TV? Gaaaahhh.)

[bitterbyrden.livejournal.com]

I'm completely obsessed with Dexter. I love it. Hall is great, Benz is great... the look of the show is awesome, the casting is great (I love his sister!) and the character of Dexter is fascinating. I thought for sure it wouldn't "make it" as a show, because I wasn't sure if America was ready to have a sociopath vigilante as a hero, but I was apparently wrong.

I've really been enjoying it. So glad to see you have, too!

[selenak.livejournal.com]

Absolutely, and I agree re: Deb (both the actress and the character). I was very happy to see the last episode explore what all that Dexter-and-Harry alone time meant for her as a child. And seeing her being a good detective (if only she knew).

[buffyannotater.livejournal.com]

I disagree about Torchwood, but could not agree more about Dexter, which is my favorite new show on the air right now.

I especially like the way the supporting characters have been fleshed out; people like La Guerta and Doakes, introduced as possible antagonists, come across as three dimensional, with their own storylines and rich emotional background. Rita, Julie Benz' character, is as said in her introduction damaged, but given a quiet strength and not at all the eternal damsel in distress.

Yes, and this is all the show's doing, as in the original novel, they have absolutely no depth whatsoever, to the point that it comes across as rather racist and misogynistic, since every character of color or female is either an antagonist, incompetent, too damaged to function, or all of the above. Meanwhile, Dexter, the only good character in the novel, is himself fleshed out tenfold here. This is a Godfather-like case where a pulpy, not particularly well-written novel is improved greatly on film. I particularly love how Dexter is being used as an extreme Everyman metaphor--how his isolation and distance from the rest of humanity is paralleled with the other characters'. And how he doesn't realize that everyone has the same sort of questions about what other humans are thinking or why they act the way they do. This is an aspect completely missing from the book, to its detriment.

Plus...

[buffyannotater.livejournal.com]

...the fact that he isn't a typical Vigilante--that he kills not as means to an end, but because he loves doing it, plain and simple, and that it is who he chooses to kill that distinguishes him from any other serial killer, is what makes him most fascinating.

Re: Plus...

[selenak.livejournal.com]

Yes, which is why I'm glad Dexter's reaction to the Ice Truck killer, the fascination, makes it clear he really does love to kill and that the inhibition Harry installed re: his choice of victims is coming from outside.

At the same time, of course, it seems he's internalized it enough to make by himself an interesting nature versus nurture argument - with nurture being surprisingly strong.

Guess that means I won't read the novel, and yes, it sounds like a Godfather case.

Re: Plus...

[londonkds.livejournal.com]

Oh, I think it's a subtext of a lot of stories about killer vigilantes that they actually do it because they like it. Dexter sounds unusual because he not only admits to it but doesn't feel the need for long and hypocritical angsting over it ;-)

Re: Plus...

[buffyannotater.livejournal.com]

Dexter, refreshingly, only angsts when he worries about being caught. :-)

[viciouswishes.livejournal.com]

See, no one pimped Dexter to me appropriately. They were all like "murder, mayhem, serial killers" which while peaking my interest doesn't seal it. They all needed to add Julie Benz and Michael C. Hall and now I'm like "must watch."

You win for the day.

[selenak.livejournal.com]

*bows*