Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix
Jul. 13th, 2007 08:30 am![[personal profile]](https://www.dreamwidth.org/img/silk/identity/user.png){kind=small}
selenakGiven that this is my favourite of the Potter books, and also has the problem of being the longst and thus most difficult to cut down to cinematic size, I went in a bit anxious.
Firstly, one thing that did translate really well was the Umbridge plot. I mean, given Imelda Staunton's track record, I knew she'd be splendid, but it's still nice to see expectations exceeded. Especially since much of the other plot about the corruption and inherent problems of the wizarding world is gone (Kreacher is still there, but as with SPEW in the previous Goblet of Fire, the whole houselves-as-slaves (and not just to the Malfoys as seen in CoS) is lost, for example), thus leaving Umbridge as the sole manifestation of things wrong in the wizarding world that aren't caused by Voldemort. And the way Hogwarts went from a magic heaven to hell for Harry comes across perfectly. The scene where Umbridge makes him write in his own blood is as chilling as it is in the book (with the same obvious real life child abuse parallels - "deep down, you know you deserve to be punished"), and the sequence concerning Trelawney's dismissal is petty power incarnate, with the same effect it has in the books of making Sybil Trelawney from a comic relief character to a human being one feels for.
Secondly, one thing I thought was missing was the theme of fallible father figures, and disillusionment with same. Finally some of the Snape versus Marauders backstory makes it on screen (after the entire "prank" revelation being cut from the PoA film) - and we don't see the emotional impact this has on Harry, which is, shall we say, somewhat important in the book. The discovery that his father used to be a bully at school (and Sirius and Remus aided and abetted) and that he has a moment of identifying with Snape which horrifies him - limited to a single reaction shot and not referred to again. I'm not sure how I feel about the change from Harry seeing those memories because he looks into the pensieve versus because he actually does what he's supposed to, counter-attack during the Occlumency lessons, either, though I can see why in the interest of cinematic brevity they made it, plus they changed Snape's reaction accordingly.
The other flawed father figures are Sirius - who isn't nearly as unstable in the movie, but I can see why - they have to establish a bond between him and Harry, so we only get the positive Sirius scenes, and there is at least a hint of some of the more problematic side whe he calls Harry "James" in the ministry - and Dumbledore. No problem with the Dumbledore depiction; the "I kept you distant because I thought Voldemort might not use that connection after all if he thought I didn't like you anymore'" excuse sounds as lame as ever, but that is straight from the novel. Sadly, Harry's total melt-down in Dumbledore's office is gone, but then so is the trigger (which isn't the cause), the whole Kreacher-Sirius-news, and that ties to the Sirius being less flawed in the film and the problematic nature of the wizarding world symbolized by Umbridge but not any longer through the houseleves subplot change.
On to things I loved: the introduction scene gave us both Harry being messed up by Cedric's death and his Voldemort encounter and the chillingness of the Dementors attacking in the Muggle world in full measure. I do regret we lost the Harry-Petunia moment of odd kinship (because that was a big thing in the Dursley depiction in the books) and her reaction to the word "dementor", but in the interest of pace, I can see why that had to go. Tonks in her cameos was great fun and very vibrant, but looked so young that, coupled with the way the movies cast the Potters, Snape, Sirius and Remus as 40 to 50 somethings, the Remus/Tonks pairing to come for the first time looked slightly squicky to me.
Luna was realized perfectly, and I wouldn't be surprised if lots of Harry/Luna fanfic came out of this film, especially since she got far more screentime with him than Cho. (Not to mention Ginny. Movie-only people are probably going to be caught by complete surprise about that one in the next story, though there was one moment of Ginny looking back at Harry that was a set-up. Sadly, they did cut out what I thought was Ginny's best moment so far, her pointing out to Harry that she knows exactly what it's like to be possessed by Voldemort, Harry's startled "I forgot" and Ginny's cool "Lucky you".) Speaking of poor Cho, the cut of Marietta as the sneak and transference to her via Veritaserum worked; it gave hers and Harry's relationship a logical end yet did not make her look bad. (Unless moviegoers don't remember what Veritaserum is.) However, cutting Marietta also means excluding some of Hermione's more ruthless actions, which ties with the way the Centaur plot is presented. When reading the book, I had no doubt Hermione knew what she was doing when leading Umbridge into the forest, and that the results were what she intended. Not sure whether or not this softening of Hermione's ruthless streak is done for the cinematic audience or just because it saves expositionary dialogue.
Back to Luna: I do wish they'd have ended the film with the scene between her and Harry (which is rendered superbly), instead of adding a "go team, friendship rocks!" one between the Trio, but otoh considering the film-long enstragement between Harry and friends that one was probably necessary. Rupert Grint as in the last movie stopped grimacing, which is very welcome, and this film finally doesn't treat Ron as comic relief anymore, which is even more welcome.
Bad guys: Helena Bonham Carter as Bellatrix post Azkaban is suitably deranged (I'm curious whether the next film will include her and how she'll handle the more sane Bellatrix in the opening scene), and her licking her Death Eater tattoo is just about the most joyfully perverse villain moment in any of the Potter films. Kudos. Screen!Voldemort continues to be more impressive than the book version due to being embodied by Ralph Fiennes, and thanks, script, for including Dumbledore calling him "Tom". Jason Isaacs is realiably good as Lucius Malfoy. But you know what? I seriously doubt film viewers understood why the prophecy was such a big deal to Voldemort.
Lovely details: the Black family tree, which has Tonks' mother Andromeda blasted out without this being referred to in on screen dialogue but clearly shown, and, interestingly if a bit confusingly, has Phineas blasted out as well. (Phineas Nigellus gets name-checked by Dumbledore when ordering the portraits around and otherwise didn't make the cut, but again, screentime.) Umbridge's office in all its pinkness. Neville and Harry watching the picture of their parents together. Neville's two biggest scenes from the book - the one with the bubble gum paper when visiting his mother and the one where he goes up against Bellatrix - aren't in the film, but he gets a reasonable amount of screen time, and the growing friendship between him and Harry is emphasized.
Special effects: the big showdown between Death Eaters and members of the Order was impressive as hell.
Firstly, one thing that did translate really well was the Umbridge plot. I mean, given Imelda Staunton's track record, I knew she'd be splendid, but it's still nice to see expectations exceeded. Especially since much of the other plot about the corruption and inherent problems of the wizarding world is gone (Kreacher is still there, but as with SPEW in the previous Goblet of Fire, the whole houselves-as-slaves (and not just to the Malfoys as seen in CoS) is lost, for example), thus leaving Umbridge as the sole manifestation of things wrong in the wizarding world that aren't caused by Voldemort. And the way Hogwarts went from a magic heaven to hell for Harry comes across perfectly. The scene where Umbridge makes him write in his own blood is as chilling as it is in the book (with the same obvious real life child abuse parallels - "deep down, you know you deserve to be punished"), and the sequence concerning Trelawney's dismissal is petty power incarnate, with the same effect it has in the books of making Sybil Trelawney from a comic relief character to a human being one feels for.
Secondly, one thing I thought was missing was the theme of fallible father figures, and disillusionment with same. Finally some of the Snape versus Marauders backstory makes it on screen (after the entire "prank" revelation being cut from the PoA film) - and we don't see the emotional impact this has on Harry, which is, shall we say, somewhat important in the book. The discovery that his father used to be a bully at school (and Sirius and Remus aided and abetted) and that he has a moment of identifying with Snape which horrifies him - limited to a single reaction shot and not referred to again. I'm not sure how I feel about the change from Harry seeing those memories because he looks into the pensieve versus because he actually does what he's supposed to, counter-attack during the Occlumency lessons, either, though I can see why in the interest of cinematic brevity they made it, plus they changed Snape's reaction accordingly.
The other flawed father figures are Sirius - who isn't nearly as unstable in the movie, but I can see why - they have to establish a bond between him and Harry, so we only get the positive Sirius scenes, and there is at least a hint of some of the more problematic side whe he calls Harry "James" in the ministry - and Dumbledore. No problem with the Dumbledore depiction; the "I kept you distant because I thought Voldemort might not use that connection after all if he thought I didn't like you anymore'" excuse sounds as lame as ever, but that is straight from the novel. Sadly, Harry's total melt-down in Dumbledore's office is gone, but then so is the trigger (which isn't the cause), the whole Kreacher-Sirius-news, and that ties to the Sirius being less flawed in the film and the problematic nature of the wizarding world symbolized by Umbridge but not any longer through the houseleves subplot change.
On to things I loved: the introduction scene gave us both Harry being messed up by Cedric's death and his Voldemort encounter and the chillingness of the Dementors attacking in the Muggle world in full measure. I do regret we lost the Harry-Petunia moment of odd kinship (because that was a big thing in the Dursley depiction in the books) and her reaction to the word "dementor", but in the interest of pace, I can see why that had to go. Tonks in her cameos was great fun and very vibrant, but looked so young that, coupled with the way the movies cast the Potters, Snape, Sirius and Remus as 40 to 50 somethings, the Remus/Tonks pairing to come for the first time looked slightly squicky to me.
Luna was realized perfectly, and I wouldn't be surprised if lots of Harry/Luna fanfic came out of this film, especially since she got far more screentime with him than Cho. (Not to mention Ginny. Movie-only people are probably going to be caught by complete surprise about that one in the next story, though there was one moment of Ginny looking back at Harry that was a set-up. Sadly, they did cut out what I thought was Ginny's best moment so far, her pointing out to Harry that she knows exactly what it's like to be possessed by Voldemort, Harry's startled "I forgot" and Ginny's cool "Lucky you".) Speaking of poor Cho, the cut of Marietta as the sneak and transference to her via Veritaserum worked; it gave hers and Harry's relationship a logical end yet did not make her look bad. (Unless moviegoers don't remember what Veritaserum is.) However, cutting Marietta also means excluding some of Hermione's more ruthless actions, which ties with the way the Centaur plot is presented. When reading the book, I had no doubt Hermione knew what she was doing when leading Umbridge into the forest, and that the results were what she intended. Not sure whether or not this softening of Hermione's ruthless streak is done for the cinematic audience or just because it saves expositionary dialogue.
Back to Luna: I do wish they'd have ended the film with the scene between her and Harry (which is rendered superbly), instead of adding a "go team, friendship rocks!" one between the Trio, but otoh considering the film-long enstragement between Harry and friends that one was probably necessary. Rupert Grint as in the last movie stopped grimacing, which is very welcome, and this film finally doesn't treat Ron as comic relief anymore, which is even more welcome.
Bad guys: Helena Bonham Carter as Bellatrix post Azkaban is suitably deranged (I'm curious whether the next film will include her and how she'll handle the more sane Bellatrix in the opening scene), and her licking her Death Eater tattoo is just about the most joyfully perverse villain moment in any of the Potter films. Kudos. Screen!Voldemort continues to be more impressive than the book version due to being embodied by Ralph Fiennes, and thanks, script, for including Dumbledore calling him "Tom". Jason Isaacs is realiably good as Lucius Malfoy. But you know what? I seriously doubt film viewers understood why the prophecy was such a big deal to Voldemort.
Lovely details: the Black family tree, which has Tonks' mother Andromeda blasted out without this being referred to in on screen dialogue but clearly shown, and, interestingly if a bit confusingly, has Phineas blasted out as well. (Phineas Nigellus gets name-checked by Dumbledore when ordering the portraits around and otherwise didn't make the cut, but again, screentime.) Umbridge's office in all its pinkness. Neville and Harry watching the picture of their parents together. Neville's two biggest scenes from the book - the one with the bubble gum paper when visiting his mother and the one where he goes up against Bellatrix - aren't in the film, but he gets a reasonable amount of screen time, and the growing friendship between him and Harry is emphasized.
Special effects: the big showdown between Death Eaters and members of the Order was impressive as hell.
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no subject
Date: 2007-07-13 06:30 am (UTC)For what it's worth, I'm choosing to believe that Hermione knew what she was doing by taking Umbridge to the centaurs. It's funny that I'd forgotten the Kreacher plot was cut -- the shots of him earlier in the film suggested so strongly that was coming that I had forgotten it wasn't used. That makes me suspect there was a reference that got dropped from the final cut. I think I missed the Snape parts most -- those are by far my favorite scenes in the book -- but I can understand how they didn't really fit in this film, that's more focused -- very successfully, I think -- on the kids. Daniel Radcliffe, particularly, keeps impressing me.
no subject
Date: 2007-07-13 10:01 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-07-13 09:15 am (UTC)What I really liked about the movie is how it made look Harry and his DA group look really competent and skilled - but only until the adults unleashed REAL magic. :-)
I can't wait for the DVD. I'd like to watch a few scenes again. Snape's worst memory had such fast editing, that I feel I missed most of it.
no subject
Date: 2007-07-13 10:04 am (UTC)Oh yes. You could see they were learning and really getting good - but then came the showdown and it was clear: good for students.
DVD: they better have a longer version of the worst memory sequence, is all I'm saying.
no subject
Date: 2007-07-13 11:28 am (UTC)My kids are pretty tough when it comes to movies. I allow them to watch almost all fantasy movies as long as we watch with them. They are very aware that what they're watching isn't real. There are movies like Die Wilden Hühner, that they find more disturbing. Especially the notion of abusive parents upsets them.
no subject
Date: 2007-07-13 11:48 am (UTC)I'm sorry to hear that they cut the message board scene between Harry and Luna. Gah. That's the definitive moment for Luna and very important for moving Harry past his grief (at least a little). I get it and I've been afraid all along that it would get cut, but ... well, if I was in charge that scene would be on a golden Do Not Cut list.
no subject
Date: 2007-07-13 11:50 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-07-13 01:47 pm (UTC)Note to self: let your eyes do the reading, not your cynicism.
no subject
Date: 2007-07-13 01:31 pm (UTC)But you know what? I seriously doubt film viewers understood why the prophecy was such a big deal to Voldemort.
Yes, exactly. In my review, when I was referring to how just 20 more minutes would have been helpful in clarifying certain things, this was one of them. I understand that the filmmakers didn't want to include all of Dumbledore's long exposition scene at the end, but there were some basic important things that weren't mentioned at all- the reason Voldemort wanted the prophecy, for example, as well as the fact that the reason that Harry has the equivalent of Voldemort's powers is precisely because as a baby, Voldemort chose him to attack and not Neville, thus transferring his powers to him. That if Voldemort hadn't been aware of this prophecy, he never would have created his own enemy. That's pretty crucial to the story.
Also, I understand the desire to not eliminate Snape's worst memory from the story, but without Harry's reaction to it, I wasn't sure what the point of keeping it in the movie was.
The only problems I had with the movie at all was in a few of these threads that weren't explained or followed through fully. On the whole, I thought it was brilliant. And while I actually don't have a problem with Harry's characterization in the book at all, I thought Yates and Daniel Radcliffe did a superb job of conveying why Harry is so outwardly irritable, without the benefit of an internal monologue, which is very impressive, since in the wrong hands, Harry's attitude could have come across without the reasons behind it.
And Umbridge was indeed practically perfect in every way, hee.
no subject
Date: 2007-07-13 02:51 pm (UTC)Indeed it is, and I don't think we'll ever get an onscreen explanation why Harry shares Voldemort's powers, starting with Parselmouth. Sigh.
Also, I understand the desire to not eliminate Snape's worst memory from the story, but without Harry's reaction to it, I wasn't sure what the point of keeping it in the movie was.
I really, really hope there are some missing scenes for the DVD, because yes, Harry's reaction to this revelation is crucial to the point of it.
I thought Yates and Daniel Radcliffe did a superb job of conveying why Harry is so outwardly irritable, without the benefit of an internal monologue, which is very impressive, since in the wrong hands, Harry's attitude could have come across without the reasons behind it.
Yes, that was very well done indeed. Oh, and the aftermath to the moment where Harry uses the Cruciatus on Bellatrix? Really well played. As was the possession moment, which was chilling and again, easily could have come across as over the top.
no subject
Date: 2007-07-13 02:34 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-07-13 02:35 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2007-07-13 02:44 pm (UTC)I'll be going with a friend of mine who has never read the books, but likes the movies a lot, so I'll quiz him afterwards whether he understood what the prophecy stuff was about.
no subject
Date: 2007-07-13 10:22 pm (UTC)The primary factors that have kept me from enjoying the movies so far is (a) bad acting and (b) bad characterization, especially of my favorite characters (Ron and Hermione). They turned Hermione into SuperGirl and Ron into a buffoon. WTF?
But apparently Ron's characterization is much improved in this movie, and it's the ONE thing that's starting to sway me. Hmmm. I'll have to think about it.
no subject
Date: 2007-07-14 05:12 am (UTC)...might have something to do with Kloves no longer writing the scripts?
no subject
Date: 2007-07-14 04:44 pm (UTC)