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selenak: (Ten by Cheesygirl)
[personal profile] selenak
In which we learn that Peter Davison has really awesome genetics.



Seriously, while casting an actress who's the daughter of the actor who played the Fifth Doctor as, well, the Doctor's daughter might have been a gimmik, it paid off. She was very endearing and absolutely believable as a cross between the Doctor's genetic make-up and conditioning via machine who becomes her own person in the short space of an episode. Said episode, written by Stephen Greenhorn who last wrote The Lazarus Experiment in s3, was, like that earlier episode, good though not spectacular, with the usual DW dodgy science. I really enjoyed it. We got more Donna 'n Martha bonding, Donna using her temp skills to figure things out again, Martha being a doctor (when she got captured again I was prepared to groan, but then she stopped being a captive in no times flat, won by medical skills and made her way to the source, so that was good), and good character stuff for the Doctor. Including more confirmation of the theory voiced by several reviewers last week, that the increased Pavlovian reaction to soldiers and guns of the last two regenerations is because of the Time War, not despite of it, i.e. projected self-loathing. However, there is also indication of healing - note the difference to the Fear Her remark, "I was a dad once" to Rose, which when Rose was shocked was immediately followed by distracting babble, whereas here he really talks with Donna about it. Which I ascribe not just to the difference in relationships with Rose and Donna but also to the difference of emotional states between then and now. The initial avoidance of Jenny turning into acceptance and joy and the willingness to start again mirroring that other emotional journey.

Re: Jenny's death and return - several possibilities. She could have been in a healing coma (see also: Three after getting shot but not regnerating in Frontiers in Space), or she could have taken longer to return from the dead after being shot (see also: Seven to Eight in ye dreadful tv movie) and, because unlike every other Time Lord she did not know she was supposed to change form, regenerated into her old one by instinct. Or, since "The Christmas Invasion" made it canon Time Lords can regrow organs within the first 24 hours of their regeneration, and she wasn't yet a day old, she could have simply healed from within because of that. But she's obviously set up to return to the show at some point. Finale? Specials? Who knows. And the fanfic possibilities are endless.

I loved the two hearts scene - which was a great example of both Donna being practical on a Watsonian and of showing, not telling on a Doylist level, and David Tennant was awesome in playing the Doctor's reaction with just his changing expression and nearly no text. And we got This is Gallifrey on the soundtrack again! Jenny's death scene was a strong echo of the Master's and at the same time a direct contrast, with Jenny dying because she wanted to protect him instead of wanting to devastate him in order to finally win.

And lastly: Donna, don't say forever! You might as well have signed your death warrant. Oh, I hope they'll find another way, and there are angsty precedences other than Rose of how to have an companion exit when neither he/she nor the Doctor want the separation - just ask Jamie and Zoe. Though I can't decide whether a mindwipe (which is what Jamie and Zoe got) might not even break me more than a death, because Donna should keep these memories. And stay alive, damn it! Find another way to explain the "we can't keep Catherine for more than a season" thing, team Cardiff, get creative!

Date: 2008-05-11 04:44 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] skywaterblue.livejournal.com
I like the theory that she was in the first um, 24 hours of her body and so she still had awesome Time Lord regenerative powers. (I haven't actually seen it yet. More thoughts tomorrow when I will be rested.)

Date: 2008-05-12 02:21 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] skywaterblue.livejournal.com
Extra fixit wank: Since the Doctor has a regular goldish-white, and the Master's is reddish-gold, we can say Jenny's got a greenish-gold tone when she expels Dust whatever it is Time Lords have that triggers regeneration/healing.

I liked this one a crazy shit ton despite the fact that the plot is COMPLETELY stolen from Star Trek Three. It's because of all the resonance.

Date: 2008-05-12 10:43 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] selenak.livejournal.com
The resonance does it for me, too, and hey, plot stealing is an ancient tradition in sci-fi in general and DW in particular. (Star Trek, too - how many times did they riff off 1984 by now, for example? - but that's beside the point.) My favourite example is still Terry Nation stealing H.G. Wells' Time Machine concept for the original versions of the Daleks and the Thal back in One's day. (Nation himself changed this when retconning both and making them way more complicated in Genesis of the Daleks, of course.) Though given that DW pimped Wells when they could - the Master is reading The War of the Worlds in his leisure time in Frontiers in Space, for example, and H.G. himself appears as a companion in a Sixth Doctor story - you could say they paid royalties.*g*

Point about the colours.

Date: 2008-05-11 05:45 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] x-los.livejournal.com
I'm in love with the strong Caves of Androzoni visual parallel of her in the cockpit with that lighting. Well done, whoever made that decision!

Date: 2008-05-11 06:48 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] selenak.livejournal.com
Presumably once they had cast her the director and/or some production people went back and rewatched some key Five episodes, or maybe they had them fresh in mind from rewatching for Time Crash. After all, that reshuffling of genetics brought the blond hair o' Five back, so it makes sense to plant other visual cues as well.*g*

Date: 2008-05-11 08:24 am (UTC)
andraste: The reason half the internet imagines me as Patrick Stewart. (Default)
From: [personal profile] andraste
I found Jenny delightful and would love to have her as the next companion! I thought she had lovely chemistry with the Doctor, and it would certainly be a different dynamic to any we've had before - sort of like a cross between Susan and Leela.

Date: 2008-05-11 08:31 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] selenak.livejournal.com
True that. Mind you, I always thought Ace was something like that (i.e. a cross between Susan and Leela), but Jenny would be different again by virtue of her background. Also, since she's a genetic Gallifreyan, they could recast if Georgia Moffet doesn't want to play anymore (though she seems very enthusiastic about it in the intereviews, so I think she'd be absolutely game for a longer commitment).

Lastly: I want to see the Doctor in a position where he has to give her The Talk. Though he probably would try to make Donna do it for him. *g*

(Otoh, he definitely wouldn't let Jack do it. *has visions of Jack hitting on Jenny and being confronted with Darkside!Doctor*...)

Date: 2008-05-11 08:19 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] kattahj.livejournal.com
Lastly: I want to see the Doctor in a position where he has to give her The Talk. Though he probably would try to make Donna do it for him. *g*

LOL! I'd love to see you fic that.

I'm so shallow - I loved Jenny mostly for being so sparkly and pretty. When she smiled at the guard, I froze frame and went, "Yay, Kristen Bell's smile on an even prettier face!"

Date: 2008-05-12 03:55 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] selenak.livejournal.com
...and now you have me wondering whether either Keith Mars or Bob is a fobwatched Time Lord.*g*

Jenny is very pretty. Five done good, yes. (Now that there are icons using close-ups about, the facial resemblance to the Fifth Doctor, aka the actress' Dad, is really striking.)

Date: 2008-05-13 02:18 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] selenak.livejournal.com

LOL! I'd love to see you fic that.

I didn't, but the Doctor at theatrical_muse put up a great funny post to that effect:

http://rude-not-ginger.livejournal.com/150132.html

Date: 2008-05-13 04:19 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] kattahj.livejournal.com
LOL! Thanks for the link! I'd feedback the author, but it seems to be a RPG, so I'd better not.

Date: 2008-05-24 02:06 pm (UTC)
andraste: The reason half the internet imagines me as Patrick Stewart. (Default)
From: [personal profile] andraste
Also, since she's a genetic Gallifreyan, they could recast if Georgia Moffet doesn't want to play anymore (though she seems very enthusiastic about it in the intereviews, so I think she'd be absolutely game for a longer commitment).

I read somewhere that she'd been cast in that Spooks spin-off that's due later next year, but given the cast turnover in the parent series, it's hard to say how permanent such a role would be.

Lastly: I want to see the Doctor in a position where he has to give her The Talk. Though he probably would try to make Donna do it for him. *g*

Ahahahaha. I can imagine.

(Otoh, he definitely wouldn't let Jack do it. *has visions of Jack hitting on Jenny and being confronted with Darkside!Doctor*...)

Oh, boy, yes. It would be even funnier if Jenny liked being hit on by Jack.

Date: 2008-05-11 09:36 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] londonkds.livejournal.com
(Imagines bitchy Time Lords mocking her for being dull and unimaginative enough to regenerate into the same body.)

Date: 2008-05-11 12:40 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] selenak.livejournal.com
You know, it's absolutely plausible because on what meager evidence we have every Time Lord is better at regeneration than the Doctor. If the Master wants a young strong body, he gets one; if Romana wants to look like Adra, she gets that. While the Doctor still hasn't been ginger. So, since she's based on him, Jenny mismanaging regeneration would fit the pattern...

Date: 2008-05-11 10:03 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] ffutures.livejournal.com
I'm thinking spinoff series.

Date: 2008-05-11 11:35 am (UTC)
From: [identity profile] thrance-86.livejournal.com
That's what I thought too. Since the doctor's on his 10th incarnation, he's gonna run out soon, so they can probably keep the series going by using the daughter.

Date: 2008-05-11 12:40 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] selenak.livejournal.com
I'm thinking hte BBC opening themselves several avenues for the inevitable day Actor No.13 quits...

Date: 2008-05-11 11:36 am (UTC)
kernezelda: (Default)
From: [personal profile] kernezelda
Since I didn't like Donna at all in Runaway Bride, I've been amazed at how much I like her as a regular.

I also have been enjoying these last three episodes with Martha's return, and now Jenny. It would have been very disappointing had she died.

Now, we have a Time Lord without portfolio, plus the ingrained training of a soldier, out there running about without the least clue as to the extent of her physical or mental capabilities. It'll be very interesting to see how she copes with what she finds, not only about the universe, but about her own people's past and the mystery that is the Doctor.

Date: 2008-05-11 03:32 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] selenak.livejournal.com
I agree, Jenny has so much potential as a character, and it would have been a waste to kill her off. Your description also reminds me of something I meant to include in the review: I think it was a good idea not to resurrect another Time Lord of old - they did that already with the Master, and as far as emotional connections in the past are concerned, that can't be trumped - but to have her be someone who doesn't know anything about Gallifrey, or the Doctor, just what she finds out along with her discovery of the rest of the universe. That's something new, which hasn't been done before, and I for one am looking forward to see it. THe fact she has that ingrained soldier training also is an important distinction from the past. (And btw makes me wonder about crossover potential - Jenny meets Aeryn Sun?)

I'm very glad you came around to liking Donna. And the relationship dynamics this season all around are a joy to behold - Donna and the Doctor, Donna and Martha (so glad they hit it off!), Martha and the Doctor (on a much more even footing than last season), and in this latest episode Donna, Jenny and the Doctor. *hearts season 4*

Date: 2008-05-11 12:25 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] greenpear.livejournal.com
This epsiode definitely had people thinking of how this other "Time Lady" survived the Time War and whether we'd hear something about Susan or not. Guess they're not ready to go sown that path yet.

Otherwise an enjoyable episode.

And I really hope Donna suvives with all her experiences intact. She's turned into my favorite companion of the new series. She's so amazing right with Ten but would have been just so wrong with Nine...

Date: 2008-05-11 03:37 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] selenak.livejournal.com
I think it was the right choice not to make her a survivor of the Time War. Coming so soon after the Master storyline, hers would have been inevitably overshadowed. Whereas as I said to K. above, Jenny as someone new who doesn't have any knowledge of Gallifrey or the Doctor but what she finds out has not been done before and is its own story.

A mention of Susan by name would have been nice, but we got the "I've been a father before" conversation which I loved - especially how the Doctor opened up emotionally to Donna about this - so I'm good.

Completely agreed about Donna - my favourite New Who companion, definitely. She and Nine would have rubbed each other just the wrong way, but with Ten she's terrific. *crosses fingers for Donna's survival and memories*

Date: 2008-05-11 12:56 pm (UTC)
ext_23799: (Default)
From: [identity profile] aralias.livejournal.com
good theory about the first 24 hours. that's the only one so far that doesn't make me want to scream and throw things. regneration would have been more fun... because i do like jenny, so i do kind of want her back, but not if they want to shoot her first.

Date: 2008-05-11 02:49 pm (UTC)
ext_23738: donna noble (Default)
From: [identity profile] wondygal.livejournal.com
Or, since "The Christmas Invasion" made it canon Time Lords can regrow organs within the first 24 hours of their regeneration, and she wasn't yet a day old, she could have simply healed from within because of that.

Oh, hadn't thought of that! I like it. My thought was that it was the life-bringing power of the source, because the effects were so similar, instead of being golden like in regenerations scenes.

OH DONNA NO. DONNAAA.

This episode was strange to me, because I didn't love it, though I thought there was some great character stuff, but I agree when everyone says what they loved! I'll have to watch it again at a later date.

Date: 2008-07-02 04:03 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] oracne.livejournal.com
I wondered why the Doctor didn't go nuts about the machine that pretty much instantaneously made another Time Lord. Where was his urge to repopulate his species? I think this might show he doesn't have that urge, and feels their time is done. Or at least, doesn't want to make warlike Time Lords. As if he couldn't tinker with the machine.

Date: 2008-07-02 04:39 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] selenak.livejournal.com
He could - i.e. filter the war programming out - but he'd still have only himself as template. And genetic reshuffling or not, that would make everything horribly incesteous when it came to these new Time Lords continuing to repopulate the species!

Date: 2008-07-02 06:33 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] oracne.livejournal.com
Ewwwwwwwwwww.

What if different regenrations breed with his clones?

Ewwwwwwwwwwww. Shades of Lazarus Long....

Date: 2008-07-02 06:37 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] selenak.livejournal.com
Which clearly is why he left that machine alone!

Date: 2008-07-05 03:55 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] buffyannotater.livejournal.com
Great review!

Just wanted to let you know, if you didn't notice, that you tagged this episode "doctor who" instead of "dr. who," like you did most of the others, so when I checked your "dr. who" tag to go through your backlog of reviews, this one didn't come up, but I figured you just had to have reviewed it, so found this just going post by post from "Poison Sky". Thought you might want to fix the tag, just so the review wouldn't be missed by someone else checking your Who-y archives. :)

Date: 2008-07-05 05:19 pm (UTC)
From: [identity profile] selenak.livejournal.com
Oh, thanks for pointing it out - have edited now!

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