On the virtues of both/and instead of either/or

[selenak]

Back from the conference, and already preparing for the next trip. I'll be in Iceland from Wednesday till Sunday - not vacation, work, though of course I'll try to see as much of the country as I can in between. I'm very looking forward to it.

Thinking of fannish feuds and more dangerous RL stuff, I was reminded once again I'm usually not an either/or person. This eternal demand for exclusive partisanship seems, to me, to be somewhat dictatorial and limiting my enjoyement as a viewer/reader. Babylon 5 or Deep Space Nine? Love them both, intensely so. Deep Space Nine versus TNG? I also love both. Albeit for different reasons. DS9 is, imo, the better written show; TNG is the only one of the Treks which really has that professed virtue, a family feeling in regards to the ensemble. (Whereas Classic Trek is Three Men and Some Sidekicks.) And now then then, in between bouts of angst and arc splendour, I like that. Plus it has my favourite Captain of all time. And I have to insist that long before John Crichton ever met the Aurora Chair, everyone on DS9 got their turn at being tormented or Joss Whedon sharpened his claws with the second season of Buffy for ensemble torture, the first example of me really fearing, hurting and agonizing for a series regular, and something which happened to him which wasn't ignored the next week, was when Picard got assimilated by the Borg. Jean-Luc was a pioneer.

But back to either/or's I don't like: BtVS or AtS? Both. Early seasons of BTVS versus later seasons? Again, I love both, with a slight preference towards the later seasons. Farscape or Firefly? Great Maker, as Londo would say, why? Love Farscape, mourn Farscape. Ditto for Firefly. (Plus I do think it's silly to compare twelve episodes of a first season which never got completed with later seasons Farscape; now if we're talking about the first twelve Farscape eps, I can see the point. Though again, love both.) Or the either/or A.S. Byatt indulged in in order to bash J.K. Rowling: Harry Potter or Lord of the Rings - why? I know people who dislike both. I know people who like one but not the other. And I know people who enjoy both and think it's pointless to compare two different types of fantasy anyway.

Some links in the both/and spirit: c_elisa takes a somewhat critical view on the first season of Babylon 5; her objection center on Sinclair and Delenn and their respective actors here; bimo professers her love for Sinclair as the unsung hero of Babylon 5 here. (andrastewhite, don't read the later - it contains a spoiler for Sinclair's ultimate fate.) Me? I like the first season. (And Sinclair, and Michael O'Hare.) Though there are certainly some episodes I can take or leave, but then these do exist in every season. I do agree with c_elisa on the dreadfulness of whoever played Jason Ironheart in Mind War, btw.

Moving over to the Jossverse, Skywaterblue lists theories as to what precisely happened when Willow empowered the Potentials to become Slayers in Chosen, here.

And if you're interested in G.E. Lessing whom I raved about in an earlier entry, here is a short but instructive Who Is Who, and an English version of Nathan the Wise, the drama trying to find a solution for Muslim/Christian/Jewish coexistence, is
here, thanks to the Gutenberg Project.

Comments

[angeyja.livejournal.com]

Reykjavik?

and...

[selenak.livejournal.com]

...Akureyri, on Friday. Otherwise Reykjavik.

Re: and...

[angeyja.livejournal.com]

Ah! I miss it, even after 13 years, silly me.

Re: and...

[selenak.livejournal.com]

Any must-see tips for either city?

Re: and...

[angeyja.livejournal.com]

Nope! But, if you'd like some online links or for me to ask my relatives for suggestions let me know. You can also email through my LJ if you'd like.

Thanks, but...

[selenak.livejournal.com]

Since I'm already packing, it would be rather last minute surfing. Also, I do know someone there who'll hopefully show me around a bit between appointments.

However: the food situation. Any dishes you can recommend in particular?

[kathyh]

I'll be in Iceland from Wednesday till Sunday - not vacation, work, though of course I'll try to see as much of the country as I can in between. I'm very looking forward to it.

I am so envious that I can barely speak... not of the work bit, but the trip to Iceland. I shall go and check out the links you posted and try to conquer my jealousy *g*.

I'm neither both/and nor either/or, I think. ;-)

[hmpf.livejournal.com]

(That sounds really strange!)

I'm not a person who takes sides in fan feuds, and I don't see a reason to set one show/book/movie against another. However, I do have preferences. I enjoy both BtVS and AtS, but I enjoy AtS more. I like TNG and B5 and DS9, but if forced to choose, I'd choose DS9. Like Firefly, *love* Farscape. Enjoy HP, but prefer LotR etc. (The last comparison really doesn't make much sense to me, though, as the books have so little in common. If I'd have to find a book that would be a closer match to LotR, I would, maybe, take Memory, Sorrow and Thorn as my example. In that case, I'd still prefer LotR, though.)

I guess it's just a matter of what resonates with me. The universe, the characters... I'm still in that phase of mental development where I need a character (or, in some cases, a world) to identify with, and different shows and books and movies meet that requirement to differing degrees. Quality-wise, however, I'd say all the above mentioned things are pretty good. So, I couldn't say one is 'better' than the other (well, okay, if I'm comparing LotR and MS&T, I'd say LotR may actually be 'better' on a more or less objective scale), but then, personal emotional attachment to a certain media product is not necessarily just based on superior quality.

Will you take a camera to Iceland and take some pictures and post them here? Pretty please? The landscapes there are so breathtaking...

;-)

the nonsense of...

[selenak.livejournal.com]

a HP/LotR comparison was pointed out by various sources when Byatt made it. Whereas Memory, Sorrow and Thorn is, as rozk once said, one long argument with Tolkien and thus can be compared.

[misshallelujah.livejournal.com]

I don't see why people have to have fannish feuds; it's just a choice of what we like and what we don't, right? Like, when I first got into the Star Trek fandom, I totally couldn't get the whole Star Trek vs. Star Wars thing.

Iceland! That sounds absolutely wonderful...

~~June

feuds are a waste of energy

[selenak.livejournal.com]

...if you ask me. Of course there will be always things one dislikes. But why devote hours of ranting to them instead of enjoying things one does like?

ST vs SW: silly. Mostly a guy thing, though; at least I don't recall any female fans I knew having endless quarrels about whether the Enterprise-D could go up against a Star Destroyer...

[twistingflame.livejournal.com]

I'm beginning to think it's impossible for me to dislike one of your posts. I'd quote my fave bits, but essentially I agree with all of it (with the exception that I've never seen Farscape and so have no frame of reference re Firefly.) The most ridiculous of all the comparisons has to be HP vs LotR though. I mean, in a general sense, I guess they're both fantasy, but the books couldn't be any different. Someone actually compared them in all seriousness?

Someone did.

[selenak.livejournal.com]

And not just any someone, but an author I otherwise appreciate, A.S. Byatt. In article about how HP was missing all the numinous qualities of LotR, aimed at people who watch soap operas and reality TV. koimistress wrote the best analysis of this strange event.

[andraste]

The trouble with comparisons is that you often end up trying to choose between apples and oranges. I mean, where are the grounds for comparison between Star Wars and Star Trek other than the fact that they're both science fiction? They're different stories, trying to do and say completely different things.

Of course it's possible to like one more than the other, but trying to decide which is better seems fruitless. (If you'll pardon the terrible, though accidental, pun.) Comparing apples to other kinds of apples - different versions of Trek, for example - can be more interesting.

Even then, though, it's probably more useful to compare aspects of a show than to compare shows themselves. It's fun to look at how different shows handle an ensemble cast, continuity, story arcs, who was the best Star Fleet captain ...

[(Anonymous)]

Fan wars are not something, that i have given much thought over. That some people have another taste then me should be a given. But I am afraid that it is a common defence mechanise, to attack competitor over for readers, viewers etc. to at least create an elite feeling, in your subgroup that separate you, from the common consumer.

That a writer would public criticise a fantasy writer writings. And says that she don’t think that one writer, is not as a good writer as another writer. Would I think as being a highly desirable state, compared to state we have now in Denmark. Where one gets the feeling, that just because a book is in fantasy / sf genre, can it not be considered literature, or not at least good literature. Or if somebody tries to defend fantasy or sf, they uses the Margaret Atwood defence: that the fantasy/sf is really a social comment over signs, that the writer sees in their in their time. And not let fantasy or sf or be genre that stands for it self. Karen Blixen “Seven Gothic Tales” got rejected from publisher in Denmark in the 30’iets because it was to fantastic, it was first when she translated it to English that she found a publisher in USA. Sadly enough has not much changed here since then.

A good fan war rant would I consider David Brin’s Star Wars" despots vs. "Star Trek" populists (http://www.salon.com/ent/movies/feature/1999/06/15/brin_main/)
And I think that Enterprise-D could go up against a Star Destroyer. Enterprise-D seems to have functional computer targeting system :)

lakrids

Considering that...

[selenak.livejournal.com]

...Homer's Odysee could be classified as one crackin' fantasy epos (and the template of who knows how many), the snobbery towards the genre is decidedly odd, yes.

Of course individual preferences are a given The reason I consider fannish wars superfluous: nobody ever convinces anyone, a lot of bad temper is aroused, and what should be fun becomes vitriol.

David Brin: if that's the rant I read some months ago: it made me think he missed the point of the SW prequels entirely, but hey. Not argueing here.